SID:  Hello Sid Roth your investigative reporter here with William Morford, and I am so excited because he’s a Greek scholar and he has a fresh new translation of the New Testament that will make, I think, most of the others obsolete. Why do I say this? Because he explains Hebrew idioms; a Hebrew idiom is an expression at the time that Jesus walked in the flesh that you can’t take literally. If you take it literally, you’ll miss what he was saying. He also restores the Jewish roots to the New Testament. Again, culturally, if you don’t understand the culture, you will miss what Jesus is saying. But the most exciting thing as far as I’m concerned, and William Morford, I was talking to you before we went on the air, and I said as a Greek scholar that God commissioned to do a fresh translation of the New Testament; it was, I know it was a commission by God. It’s my favorite reading Bible now and I take it with me wherever I go. There were many things literally you were angry over when you saw the other translations, but I asked you what was the thing that made you the angriest?

WILLIAM:  The lack of power – because the Jewish people today are still very expressive and that enthusiasm and the power carries through into the Greek. And the Greek language is a very, very expressive language.

SID:  Now I know what you’re saying because I’ve read this, but I read other Bibles and somehow you have captured the power that the other translations do not have; but give me an example.

WILLIAM:  All right one is at the pool when Jesus healed the paralytic who had been there 39 years. Jesus told him not to just get up and carry his pallet, but he said you must immediately get up and you must continually walk with your pallet.

SID:  That makes such a difference

WILLIAM:  Yes, and see you have to do it immediately; we have to receive a healing and then walk like we have it; go away like Hannah left the temple, the tabernacle, after she prayed before Samuel was born. When she left that tabernacle after talking to Eli, she knew; her countenance was different already. Ours should be different; we should carry our healing and know that we’re to keep it.

SID:  You know there’s a Greek word you translate, and I don’t see it translated that way in other translations, where many times it says, you translated, you are to ‘take’ from the kingdom, from the invisible realm; whereas the words used in King James and some of these other, all these other translations, they just don’t have that action. And I took that one phrase – ‘take.’ And because see I know in the invisible realm, I can just reach my hand through to that invisible realm and pull in what I am believing God for. You know because the word of God is alive but the way that you put the action back into the language. Sickness – I have never seen this before, but in your Bible you don’t call sickness “sickness,” you call it “evil.” Why?

WILLIAM:  Because the word that I translated evil is cockos and that’s the primary meaning of the word. Sickness was just because the translators didn’t know how to deal with it; they didn’t understand deliverance for instance, or that the devil is the source for sickness.

SID: And a lot of people say well God uses sickness to teach me something, to get me closer to God, but there is no evil in God.

WILLIAM:  That’s right.

SID:  And so when you say evil rather than sickness you call it for what it is – something evil, an intelligent being that is evil.

WILLIAM: That’s right

SID: I’m so excited about that, but then it’s like a two edged sword. You talk about the Jewish roots. How in the world did you ever get into that?  You’re not Jewish.

WILLIAM:  No, it was amazing; to start this I had no intention of ever publishing the translation of the Greek; and I kept practicing with Greek. I translated for years and years and years just so I wouldn’t forget the Greek that I’d learned; because it was a painful experience learning all of that.

SID:  It’s difficult

WILLIAM:  That’s right

SID:  So why did you? No why did you learn Greek? The average person does not learn Greek

WILLIAM:  I know that you have to learn the languages to really understand scripture; you have to study both Hebrew and Greek, and I just wanted to have more of God in me. I wanted to have a better understanding of who He is and of what kind of relationship He wants with me, and to do that you have to study the languages, or

SID:  But you had such an eminent professor and when he read this translation of your Bible, what did he say?

WILLIAM:  He took me around and introduced me to a number of people in his church and he said this is one of my students who has surpassed me.

SID:  But you know I don’t believe it was a natural thing; I believe it was a destiny we have a Hebrew word: it’s bashert; it was meant to be. So you have this desire to learn Greek, you surpassed your teachers but at the same time how did you get involved in the Jewish roots because if you miss the Jewish roots you miss this book it was written by Jews for Jews in a Jewish culture? Give me a break!

WILLIAM:  Okay the answer to that lies, we were then living in Lakeland Florida. That’s when the Lord told me to get serious with the translation and I knew that I had to do it; I was just driven to do it. And I had looked for a Messianic rabbi around and there was none close by, but there was one Jewish synagogue. So I called and made an appointment and talked with the rabbi in there and we ended up becoming very close friends. And that rabbi is the grandson of Eliezer Ben-Yehuda the namesake grandson.

SID:  And for those who do not know who Eliezer Ben-Yahuda is, explain.

WILLIAM:  He is the man, who over a hundred years ago reintroduced Hebrew as the common language of Israel.

SID:  He is the modern architect of spoken Hebrew today. Don’t go away it is fantastic!

Sid:  I said what about Gog and Magog and you said.

Joel:  One of my convictions is that all the prophets throughout the Bible, are all basically telling the same story. They’re all looking to and prophesying through the various different events through the day and they’re all pointing to the coming of the Messiah and the events that surrounding His coming. The basic story that they’re telling is that in the last days the antichrist, a charismatic military religious political leader will emerge. He gathers a vast coalition of nations primarily defined as a ten-nation coalition with many nations with them. They invade the land of Israel. The antichrist succeeds in all that he does. He crushes the power of the holy one, Israel. In Israel’s darkest hour, the Messiah returns, He delivers them, they turn to Him forever, He rules the earth from Mt. Zion. That’s the basic story. If people get that basic story down, then they look at the prophets and they see that all the prophets are telling the same story from a slightly different angle. When we get to Ezekiel 38:39, so many Christians try to complicate this and say, “This is a different charismatic military leader. This is a different coalition of nations. This is a different invasion of Israel, a different supernatural victory of the Messiah.” There is a significant key in the passage. God looks and speaks to Gog and says, “Are you not the one that I have spoken of by my former prophets? For many years they prophesied that I would bring you against Israel.” When people look at that they go “Wait a minute. So you’re saying that all of the former prophets that came before Ezekiel were talking about Gog.” If that’s the case, if Gog is someone other than the antichrist, then I say, “Show me one other prophet that’s talking about a Russian-led coalition.” They go silent. Ezekiel is telling the same story that all the prophets are talking about that Gog is another name for the antichrist. Why have people made Gog into something else. The answer is that when they look at the nation, they’re not Roman or European. They’re Middle Eastern. They go, “This can’t fit with some of our previous suppositions.” In order for their whole world-view to work, they need a mechanism to eliminate the world of Islam, because the bottom line is that everyone who does not worship the antichrist will be martyred or persecuted. We know that if there was an antichrist in the earth, the Muslims would not follow him if he was a humanist or Catholic or universalist. If the antichrist is a Muslim leader, then suddenly it makes sense why the Middle East would follow him, why the 1.7 billion would follow him, and why the most anti-Semitic people in the world that surround the nation of Israel today would follow him.

Sid:  You mentioned some things of George Freeman who is the CEO and founder of Stratford the world’s leading private intelligence forecasting company. What does he say about Turkey?

Joel:  This is what’s so fascinating. For years I’ve been saying that the Bible is clear. Turkey will re-emerge as the regional leader of the Middle East. In Freeman’s recent book called “The Next Hundred Years,” he says that in the years to come we will see Turkey emerge as a global super power as the most dominant power in the Middle East. He says that as the Western nations evacuate the Middle East, there will be an inevitable vacuum. History shows that the Middle East is not capable of being dominated by a foreign, Western power, but it is capable of being dominated by a Muslim power. Turkey historically has been the nation that has been able to do that for over five hundred years. Right up until 1924, the Turks ruled the entire Middle East. In the years to come, non Bible-believing secular analysts are saying that that is going to take place. The head wound that appeared to be fatal, is being healed, and the beast is arising from the ashes right before our eyes.

Sid:  What is God’s Holy Mountain Project?

Joel:  God’s Holy Mountain Project is an inter-faith project in Israel founded by Yoav Frankel. He’s an Orthodox Jew. Their desire is to see on the temple both the Mosque of Omar as well as a Jewish temple there on the mount side by side where everyone can go and worship God together all on this one holy location.

Sid:  Then another very intriguing man that you’ve personally met, Adnan Oktar, tell me about him.

Joel:  He is the most published author in the entire Islamic world. He has written nearly three hundred books in sixty-five languages. He literally has come out and said that he believes that during the age of the Islamic messiah they will rebuild the Jewish temple on the Temple Mount. He speaks about Muslims and Jews worshipping God together. They all believe that God is one. For the first time you have a significant Muslim leader from Turkey openly calling for the re-establishment of what he calls Solomon’s Palace on the Temple Mount.

Sid:  He has a new book. What is the premise of that?

Joel:  The new book that’s just come out is about twelve hundred pages is about how “The Mehide,” that’s the Islamic messiah figure, and Jesus will return in this century. This is one of the most significant Islamic books to come out speaking of their messiah figure as well as what they believe is the Islamic Jesus. They believe he’ll be the assistant to the Islamic messiah figure and that he’ll come soon.

Sid:  The best as you see it is a coalition of Islamic nations and they are going to attack the harlot who you believe is Saudi Arabia. Talk about that a little bit.

Joel:  The scripture says that the beast will turn on the woman and devour her. This is intended to be ironic. This is as if you’re watching the Lone Ranger and all of a sudden Silver turns and eats the Lone Ranger. That’s what we are supposed to see in Revelation when we’re reading Revelation. When we look at the breakdown of the Middle East, most of the radical Muslims are happy that the Saudi royals are funding their Jihad, on the other hand they look at the Saudis as an illegitimate, corrupt monarchy that needs to be overthrown. Likewise Iran would love to be the top oil-producing alpha dog of the region. Saudi Arabia’s terrified of Iran. They’re also terrified of a re-emerging Turkish dominance in the region. Right now Saudi Arabia’s quaking in their boots. There was just a news article recently that said that Saudi Arabia was allowing Israeli jets to land in Saudi Arabia for the purpose of potentially attacking Iran. What a lot of people believe is that this thing would break down between Sunni and Shia, but in fact what’s happening is we will see the coming together of various Islamic nations that are radical Islamists and on the other hand you have Saudi, Jordan, and Egypt. They tend to be viewed as more western-friendly. It’s really the more so-called modern nations versus the more radical Islamist nations that desire to see the re-establishment of a caliphate.

Sid:  And a caliphate is?

Joel:  It is the Islamic government run by the police, which is the pope, president, and general of the entire Islamic world.

Sid:  I know they have a plan for Britain to become Islamic. What about for the U.S.?

Joel:  Well of course they would love to see it, but as an intercessor, I’m saying that’s not going to happen. I’m going to stand with my nation and believe that we’ll remain strong as much as possible.

Sid:  Joel on yesterday’s broadcast, you articulated very clearly who Mystery Babylon was. You explained that it is Saudi Arabia. Especially in Revelation 17 and 18, Isaiah 15, Jeremiah 50, and 1 Peter 5:13 you go by brilliantly point by point the scriptures and show all the other nations cannot qualify based on what the scriptures say, and only Saudi Arabia can qualify. Just briefly tell us a few reasons why Saudi Arabia is the harlot.

Joel:  One of the criteria that the Bible lays out for us is that it says this woman will sit in an aramos, which translated is desert. If we’re talking about the Vatican or Rome or the U.S., they don’t sit in the desert. This is not just an allegorical or symbolic term that we should throw away. All of it points to it being a literal reference to the region where this woman is pictured. Another significant issue is that Saudi Arabia is a rabid consumer, and in Revelations17 and 18, the harlett is a rabid consumer. Saudi Arabia doesn’t produce anything except for oil. They literally import everything. The nations of the earth will feel the wrath of this woman’s false religion. As we discussed yesterday, Saudi Arabia is the premier financier of terrorism.

Sid:  It talks about extravagant luxury. Why does Saudi Arabia qualify?

Joel:  Saudi Arabia is unlike any other nation in the world. It’s a nation that is run by a family that is drowning in wealth, and when you look at examples of Saudi luxury, it absolutely surpasses any American President, actor, or real estate mogul. These Saudi princes have so much money to throw around, and the amount of luxury and excess that they live in is unparalleled, and it meets that description that we see reiterated in Revelation.

Sid:  Another thing it says is that the people of the earth will commit fornication with this Great Harlot.

Joel:  This is one of the most significant and important criteria. It needs to be realized that this word fornication is not adultery. A lot of believers have said that this indicates that whoever, this woman is, that she existed in a preexisting covenant with God and then broke it. That would be adultery. The word used in Greek was not adultery but fornication. What that means is that anyone throughout the earth, who does not worship his Creator, the one true God of the Bible, is involved in idolatry. That’s fornication. In the Old Testament there are examples of pagan cities such as Ninevah and Thyre that were called fornicators because they were involved in idolatry. Saudi Arabia today funds, spreads and exports the radical Islamic ideology.

Sid:  Give me an example of what they’re doing to the American universities right in the open.

Joel:  There’s one prince that’s very worthy of taking note of-Alwaleed Bin Talal. He’s one of the wealthiest of all the Saudi princes. He throws money around left and right to promote the Islamic cause. He gave the Harvard University and Georgetown University each 20 million dollars to establish what they’ll call an Islamic studies program, which ultimately amounts to nothing more than a Saudi Arabia wahabi propaganda studies program to spread radical Islam or to spread looking at Islam favorably throughout the earth. Prince Alwaleed comes over to the U.S. and he lectures these universities on the U.S. needing to be more tolerant.

Sid:  When I think of Harvard University, I think of a large Jewish population. Maybe I’m wrong. How in the world do the Jewish students put up with that?

Joel:  The way that the Islamists work is that they preach out of one side of their mouth a peaceful and tolerant form of Islam, and they lecture us, and they demand that we are more tolerant, but then back in their own country they don’t allow a single synagogue or church or any other religious institution to be built other than a mosque. They play both sides, and we here in the West who have been hand-strung by moral and cultural relativity, welcome it and we say, “Yes we of all people need to be more tolerant.”

Sid:  Now could it be that former President Bush spread the lie that Islam is a peace-loving religion because of his long family ties with the Saudi royalty?

Joel:  Few people realize the depth that there is in regard to the Bush family with the Saudi princes. Prince Bandar was the Saudi Arabian ambassador to the U.S. for many years. He is a deep and close friend of the Bush family. We need to realize that this individual over the years has been seen making statements, which indicate that he does support radical Islam to a degree.

Sid:  Why does someone like former President Jimmy Carter bash Israel so much? Is there an ulterior motive that you know of?

Joel:  I think that can be answered with three words. That’s money, money, money. When you look at the history of Carter’s relationship with the Saudis, he’s never come out and opened up about how much money they’ve donated and given to him in various gifts. It is in the tens of millions perhaps even more. Anyone who thinks that 10, 20, 30, 40, 50 million dollars doesn’t have an impact on somebody, they’ve never heard the term blackmail or the Saudi lobby-this has deeply impacted the approach Carter has taken. He will openly bash Israel and refer to Israel as an apartheid nation. He will never once mention the human rights violations that are so rampant in the nation of Saudi Arabia. This is blatant hypocrisy, and that’s what the Saudis get with their tens of millions of dollars put in the back pocket of even American presidents.

Sid:  What about someone like our secretary of state Hillary Clinton or her husband?

Joel:  Just before the election it was revealed that the Clintons had to open up their donation list, and what we saw was that they had received over thirty million dollars from Saudi and gulf Arabs. Whether it’s Bush, Carter, Clinton, Obama.

Sid:  What did Obama get?

Joel:  Those who have studied history say that when he went to college, he was funded by Saudi princes. There were some radical black nationalists that converted to Islam and had ties to the Saudi family, and through that Obama’s education was funded. Today he still has ties to the Saudi Arabian government. When we look at the scripture, it’s very clear. It says that the kings of the earth commit adultery with her. This is one of the premier descriptions of the harlot. When we look at the greatest most significant leaders, the kings of the earth so to speak, we see that every one of them is literally committing adultery with the Saudi princes.

Sid:  If we see this harlot as Saudi Arabia then who is the beast and define the beast.

Joel:  The beast is a coalition of ten nations and many other nations that will be involved with them that will come together in the last days and form the final manifestation of beast-empire. In Revelation 13 it says that the beast had a fatal head wound, and then it came back. In essence this is referring to an empire that appeared dead and then was revived. As I mention and discuss in my DVDs, the primary nations that will make up the beast-empire are the nations of Turkey, Syria, Lebanon, Iran, Iraq, Sudan and Lybia. These are the nations that will make up the revived Islamic empire. The head-wound that the beast suffers, a lot of Christians believe that is referring to the antichrist. The motive of beast comes from Daniel 7 and it is referring to an empire. For over five hundred years the nation of Turkey ruled the Middle East.

Sid:  Where do Gog and Magog come in? Isn’t that Russia?

Joel:  That’s what many people say. Unfortunately if you look at Ezekiel

Sid:  We’re out of time. Lets pick up there on tomorrow’s broadcast.

Sid:  Joel Richardson, there’s some terms that we read about-Mystery Babylon, Great Harlot. You’ve connected the dots in a way I have not seen before. Tell me who Mystery Babylon is. Is it Rome, New York City?

Joel:  Well, Mystery Babylon is probably indentifying this mysterious woman in Revelation 17 and 18. It’s really one of the greatest mysteries of Bible prophecy. Rome, New York City, the United States-these are all suggestions that have been put forward as theories. Some people say it is the summation of all the false religions systems down through history. The key to unlocking the identity of the Mystery Babylon is found in a really strange place. It’s in the last chapter of the first epistle of Peter. The clue that we find there is that Peter was actually in Rome at the time that early church history is thoroughly consistent and universal with the idea that Peter was in Rome. Writing from Rome he said, “The church that is in Babylon.” He used the word Babylon and applied it to the city of Rome. What we learn from that is when we see and understand the simple story that is laid out in Revelation 12, 13, 17 and 18, it’s a story of seven world, biblical, and historical empires that have been empires that have all carried a satanic and anti-Semitic and later an antichrist spirit. Each one of these empires have been the primary empires down through a biblical and world history that have sought to destroy the Jewish people. That story is told where this beast is sitting before the woman in the book of Revelation, and this woman is Israel. She’s about to give birth to a male child Who is the Messiah. This beast which is satan wants to devour Israel. He wants to devour the Messiah to thwart God’s plan for the ages through the Messiah. Satan’s primary tool down through the ages has been this series of world-pagan empires-these anti-Semitic empires. Babylon was the city that was the spiritual and financial capitol of ancient Babylonia. That was one of these beasts-these satanic empires of history. In the first century, when the epistle of Peter was written, the Roman Empire was the beast empire of that time. In Revelation 17 we see that Rome was the empire that was the sixth in the list of empires. The city of Rome was spiritual and financial capitol of the Roman Empire. We have this pattern which is simply to say that Mystery Babylon is the reigning spiritual and economic capitol of whichever beast empire is dominant in the earth at this time, and as I discussed in the DVD series, the beast empire of our day that follows after the pattern of all of these previous pagan empires is the Islamic Empire.

Sid:  In your teaching you explain, why it can’t be a lot of the other places that people said from scripture, but now the big question is, “Where is the capitol of that empire.”

Joel:  This comes across as novel to most people when they first hear it. But I think that you’ll agree that after it’s expounded, it made more sense than anything I had ever heard. The reason is, Sid, is that Revelation 17 and 18 gives us numerous criteria to identify Mystery Babylon, and of the different suggestions that you’ve mentioned that have been popular in the church through recent years and down through history, all of them meet some of the criteria, but none of them meet all the criteria. All these theories have a few significant problems. However, the identification that I’m about to mention doesn’t have any problems. It matches all of the criteria to a “T.” If we agree that the primary anti-Semitic, antichrist empire of the earth today is the Islamic Empire, then we ask, “What is the spiritual and financial capitol of that empire?” The question that I like to ask people is, “Were do 1.7 billion people pray five times a day toward a particular city in the earth?” That city is Mecca. Mecca is the greatest city of idolatry that the world has ever seen.

Sid:  That’s in Saudi Arabia.

Joel:  That’s the spiritual capitol, and beyond that Saudi Arabia unequivocally is the greatest financial source of terrorism and radical Islam throughout the earth beyond any other nation. Saudi Arabia is the nation that has funded the spread of Osama Bin Laden, Al Qaeda, and all these various groups. They pay for the Islamic centers, mosques, and the midrosis, they raise up radical hate preachers, they send them out as missionaries, they fill the mosques with the radical anti-Semitic literature that has the Saudi Arabian’s signature in the books. The city of Mecca is the womb from which Islam burst forth into the earth, and today Saudi Arabia is still the spiritual and financial womb of all of the radical Islam.

Sid:  Out of curiosity, who would you say these one and a half billion people are praying to? Who are they praying to five times a day facing Mecca?

Joel:  There’s two ways to answer that question. First of all I would say that if you’re worshipping any other god other than the God of the Bible, then you are committing idolatry.

Sid:  Yes, but they say allah is god. It’s just the Arabic name for god.

Joel:  Nowhere in the Bible is God ever referred to by the name of allah. The Bible does tell us the name of Abraham Isaac and Jacob. That is Yahveh. It’s very clear when He appeared to Moses in the desert, He said, “Yahveh is the name that you shall tell them. I am the One that sent you.” The fact of the matter is that allah, the god of Islam, is just one more manifestation of ancient Near Eastern, astoral, and war deities. There are numerous. There’s Zen; there’s Marduke. These are all the gods that were worshipped by the pagan people of the desert. Today, the god of Islam is just one more manifestation of satan who is trying to masquerade as the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob.

Sid:  You may not be able to answer this question but how did a man that I believe id a born-again Christian that was president of the United States, President Bush take the montra, “Islam is a peace-loving religion”? I don’t see anything in their history that’s peace-loving.

Joel:  The way that I always answer that is that I always say, “Unfortunately, in that case President Bush was being a much better politician than he was being a good theologian or good Christian. Some people would say that they understand why he was doing that, but personally as a Christian I would never openly declare such a lie.

Sid:  Joel, I’ve often pondered. Why does someone like President Bush who I believe is a born-again Christian, constantly feed us the line that Islam is a peace-loving religion? As I study it’s history, I don’t see anything peace-loving about it. I see the opposite of peace-loving, but then when I started watching your four-session and two DVDs on understanding the times, and I saw how the long family relationship of both Bushes with the Saudi royals, I began to understand how the Great Harlette is Saudi Arabia. You point out masterfully in your DVD teaching about people like President Obama and the money he got from the Saudis and Jimmy Carter and the money he got from the Saudis.

Sid:  My guest, Joel Richardson, takes a subject that most Christians will readily admit they don’t understand the end times. They don’t understand the book of Revelation. They put the whole thing on a shelf. My guest has been raised up by God to make the complex mysteries simple. Joel Richardson, because tied in with the end times is the religion of Islam, there have been numerous death threats. I can’t even tell people where you live. Is that correct?

Joel:  Yeah. I’m ok with the Midwest, but beyond that when people ask me where I am I say, “I’m in my secret bunker.”

Sid:  Ok let’s get right to the meat. I am fascinated with the information you have on our president, our former presidents, especially Jimmy Carter, but let’s get to something even more important than that because they’ll get the CDs that you have. They’ll get the DVDs that you have. Tell me a bit, I’ve never heard of this before, this treaty that throughout Muslim history show a pattern of what went on but will go on in the United States. I can’t understand how you can know this. Our state department and our administration doesn’t know this, because if they knew what you are about ready to state publicly on the air, they would never be trying to orchestrate peace agreements with the Palestinians in Israel. Tell me a bit about this treaty.

Joel:  The treaty that you mentioned is called the Treaty of Hudaybiyyah. Really what I often say is that if you want to have a basic understanding of Middle Eastern politics, and the Palestinian issue, you have to understand this treaty and it’s role in Islamic history. Unfortunately, our president administration has said, “The present issue in the world with terrorism is not related to Islam. It is merely a reaction against imperialism.” But again unless we get into Islamic theology, the religious doctrines of Islam, we’re going to miss this basic fact and it’s affect on the Middle East and not the only the Middle Eastern politics but Biblical prophecy. As the story goes, Mohammed had been kicked out of Mecca. He and his very small band of Muslim followers had moved to a nearby city of Medina, and Mecca was the religious capitol of the region. Every year the surrounding pagans would all make pilgrimage to Mecca to worship their various gods at the kaba (the cube in the middle of Mecca).

Sid:  What do you mean “the cube in the middle of Mecca”?

Joel:  The kaba is the shrine. The kaba in Arabic simply means “the cube.” It’s a black cube that is a building and that is literally the shrine that throughout the earth everyday 1.7 billion Muslims bow five times everyday towards Mecca. They pray toward the kaba, and that’s the shrine that sits in the middle of the haram sharif. That’s what they call the noble sanctuary in the middle of Mecca. During the time of Mohammed it was filled with idols so this was a shrine that was pre-existent to the religion of Islam. Mohammed told his small band, roughly a thousand people, that they were going to make pilgrimage that year. They were trying to self-fulfill this prophecy. They were approaching Mecca; they came to a place called the Spring of Hudaibiya. The most powerful tribe of the region was the Carashis. The Carashis stopped Mohammed and his men at the spring and really abused Mohammed in front of his men, mocked him quite a bit. They said, “No, you’re not going to make pilgrimage, absolutely not, but we will make a treaty with you.” This treaty has come down in Islamic history as the Treaty of Hudaibiya. They said, “From now on, if any of your men want to leave Islam, you have to let them go, but if any of our people want to convert to your group and become Muslims, you have to send them back. For the next ten years, we will have a ceasefire. You will not attack us; we will not attack you. Next year, well let you come back; you can make a pilgrimage.” The next day all of Mohammed’s men were really upset, because he was looking like a false prophet. Mohammed said that that night allah had given him a revelation. He said that this was a great victory because he realized that the most powerful tribe in the region had agreed not to attack them. Over the next two years, Mohammed began attacking a series of Jewish villages plundering, raiding, pillaging, and massacring these villages. He said to the people, “If you will join in these raids from now on, you get your percentage of the plunder, booty, women, and slaves.” Within two years as Mohammed became a pirate of the desert he went from a thousand men to roughly ten thousand. The Muslims were larger than the Carashis. He broke the Treaty of Hudaibiyah. He came and invaded Mecca. He conquered the Carashis, and he was now the undisputed leader of the entire region. Muslims today believe that Mohammed was the perfect man and perfect example for all Muslims to follow. Today all Muslim politicians and leaders, look to this example of making a treaty when you are weak in order to gain strength, in order to reload, in order to gain strategic dominance over your opponents.

Sid:  Use a modern-day example of Yasser Arafat. How did he use that treaty?

Joel:  This is going back to the eighties. Arafat had made a significant treaty with Israel. Many from the Israeli Left were very excited about this. They were talking about moving towards peace. Then Arafat was speaking before a group in South Africa. He spoke in Arabic. To the people in Arabic he said, “Listen as far I’m concerned, this treaty is just like the treaty that Mohammed himself engaged in with the Carashis. This is no more or less than the Treaty of Hudaibiyah. We will use this treaty in our onward march towards Jerusalem. What Arafat didn’t know was that someone was recording this speech. When it was translated, he was caught openly admitting that he had not literally entered into any desire for peace.

Sid: Fast-forward. President Obama, the state of Israel, and the Palestinians. What is going on when the Palestinians say, “We want a small portion of the land for ourselves”? Do you believe that for one minute?

Joel:  They call it the two-state solution. This has been something that has been pushed from the Bush administration and the Clinton. Everyone’s failed. Obama’s picking up the baton, and he’s going for the two-state solution. He’s pushing the Israeli government to go for the same thing. Netanyahu is potentially open to discussing such a thing. Within the very charter of Hamas and all of the various political leaders even the Palestinian side of the West Bank they all have history of openly stating the fact that they want to see the annihilation of the state of Israel. So while they may enter into a treaty, on order to get confession in order to see Israel give confessions and come their way, their ultimate goal is always to see the destruction of Israel.

Sid:  But wait a second. The U.S. will back Israel up. So they’ll never be able to get more than just the Palestinian state. Uh oh. Maybe that’s why our military is being weakened, and they know that.

Joel:  Absolutely. There’s no question that those in Israel on the right who refuse to even discuss a two-state solution, who are determined to be strong to make Israel’s military strong in order to rightfully defend themselves, they are on the position of right. History has born out the fact that when you have a nation of people…..

Sid: But listen. Our state department knows what you’re saying. Why are they still proceeding forward? Our administration knows-whoops we’re out of time.

Sid:  Joel is a nice Catholic from Boston, and it’s a hot day. There’s a tent meeting. A revival is going on. Now Joel is not interested in spiritual things. He just thinks that maybe he can go in that water and cool off. Is that really the way it was Joel Richardson?

Joel:  Everything except for the good before Catholic. I was raised Catholic fairly nominally. By the time that I was nineteen, which is when I came to the Lord, I was very far even from my Catholic roots. When I was nineteen, a friend of mine and I had driven from South Boston to the suburbs of Memphis, TN. It was just one street over from Elvis Presley Blvd. We pulled up to a grocery store, and in the back of this field next to the grocery store was a big old southern holiness tent revival. It was a hot day in the end of August. We had a little truck with no air conditioning. When we pulled in I had the bright idea to get baptized and cool off. My friend thought that that was a good idea. The end result was that we found the preacher. It was in between services. This was a revival that was going on for a few days. We got baptized, and of course we stayed for the meeting. There were various individuals that knew that we didn’t belong there. We had long hair at the time. I was a little South Boston hippy drug addict I guess you could say. They began trying to minister and witness to us. As the meeting went on, numerous people were being touched by the Holy Spirit. Different people were being healed. I’ve always been a skeptical individual. I was watching this and there was one gentleman who really caught my attention. He was an older gentleman who went up and he said that he had been blind most of his life. Even from a distance you could tell that his eyes were sort of white, blue, gray. He didn’t have pigment in his pupils. As the preacher prayed for him, he asked the man if he could see. Very hesitantly the man said that he thought he could a little bit. Instead of giving testimony and jumping up and down, he walked off stage and wandered out into the cars. They were all parked in the field. I followed him.

Sid:  Why?

Joel:  I was curious. I wanted to see. It was my opportunity to interview someone who said that they were being healed. He caught my attention. You could tell that he was looking around, and that he himself was pretty mystified. You could see the look of shock on his face. Something had happened. As I walked up to him, he was fifteen yards off kneeling down in the grass, I could hear sobbing and weeping like a little baby. This gentleman was probably in his sixties. I walked up and began to ask him what was taking place. He sort of interviewed me a little bit. He said that he had been blind his whole life. He could see for the first few years as a child. His hand reached up to the sky. He was just praising God. He was just weeping and he said, “Right now, I can see the stars.”

Sid:  That had to have such an impact on you, and then, that very same evening, were you saved?

Joel:  I was saved. I knew at that moment that I had to take all that was taking place seriously. I knew that no matter how much I would like to write it all off as fanaticism, I knew that something had taken place. This man was being genuine. As I went back into the meeting, the preacher was reading from the gospels. He was reading from the sermon of John the Baptist. He said, “The ax at the root of the tree has already been laid. Therefore bear in keeping with repentance lest you be cast into the fire.” At that moment, the Holy Spirit confronted me and He told me, “If you don’t repent of your entire life, your entire life is a lie. If you don’t repent tonight, right now, if you don’t completely give Me your life, you will spend eternity in hell. You will go to hell.” My response, which shocked me, was, “Absolutely. You’re right. My entire life is a lie. If I don’t repent I will end up going to hell and deserving it.”

Sid:  You know what is so obvious to me? You were set up by God, Joel. Then you became a believer. You were minding your own business in a large meeting of about seven thousand people. The prophet, who was speaking, calls you out. What does he say?

Joel:  Fast-forward several years, and my wife and I are sitting in the back of a very large auditorium. He calls both of us out. He told me that because of my faithfulness in my season of waiting on him in intercession, the Lord is going to release me into revelation and He’s going to essentially download revelation from His heart and mind to mine. He’s going to begin opening up the scriptures. This is tied into another prophecy that my wife had received that she would marry someone with new insights into the end times and that I would actually release revelation concerning the end times.

Sid:  Now you are actually doing this right now. Are you as amazed as the people you talk to of this revelation you’ve been getting? Because it’s different than most people that are teaching end times.

Joel: To a degree it is. One of the things that I continually hear as people read or listen to my material, is they say, “I had a dozen ‘aha’ moments.” I always respond by saying, “Me too as I’m writing.” Winston Churchill said, “If you want to learn about a subject, then either write a book or teach about it.” When you take the time to prepare, pray and study, when you seek the Lord in order to teach others, you yourself are taught in the process. In the process of putting so much of my material together, I have also had numerous “aha” moments.

Sid:  It must just pop out like a revelation. I know when this happens to me, I’m as mystified as excited as the people that hear it.

Joel:  I’ll tell you something personal, Sid. When I was a child, I had a repeated dream throughout my childhood. It was that I would discover a secret panel in the house that I grew up in. I would discover a secret room. I would always wake up from this dream with this intense sense of excitement that I had lived in this house my whole life, but I had never known that there was this secret room in my house. As I become an adult, I still have the dream, but it’s changed. Since becoming a believer, I have a dream that as I’m reading the Bible, I open up the Bible and I find a new book. I say, “Wait a minute. Where’s this book been? I’ve never seen this book.” As I begin reading it, it’s exciting, and there’s this energy on me. Every time I have that dream, it usually follows that as I begin opening up the Bible, I’m not literally finding a new book, but it’s as if the Lord’s opening up His books that are already there. He’s releasing understanding and revelation.

Sid:  I can tell you, Joel, that as I watch your DVD series, I am so excited the way you unfold and tie in end time Bible prophecy with current events. You have facts about who is the great harlot. You have facts about who is Babylon. You kind of connect the dots of things that we know the ingredients of, but you put together. As a matter of fact even before we share anything, I’ve got to ask you this question. I know no one knows the day or the hour that the Messiah is going to return, so I’m not stupid enough to ask you that question, but based on the information that you have in these DVDs, could everything occur in your lifetime?

Joel:  Personally, I absolutely believe that if I should live long enough that absolutely, the Lord will return in my lifetime. I do believe that He’s at the door, and I believe that we need to be about the work of the Lord as a result.

Sid:  Now you have spent over a year in the Middle East in Egypt, Jordan, and Israel. You must have had a fit when President Bush kept referring to Islam as a peace-loving religion.

Joel:  Yeah as the great religion and the religion of peace, I carry a very hard message.

Sid:  Our time is up. Trust me, if you like end time prophecy, you will love these four sessions on two DVDs called “Understanding the Times” for a donation of thirty dollars.

SID: My guest sees a series of snapshots over people and then he knows things about them. He knows their past, their present, their future, even what they said in their bedroom the night before. He’s so specific that he’s often accused of collaborating with others to get this supernatural information.

Can ancient secrets of the supernatural be rediscovered? Do angels exist? Is there life after death? Are healing miracles real? Can you get supernatural help from another dimension? Has the future been written in advance? Sid Roth has spent 30 years researching the strange world of the supernatural. Join Sid on this edition of It’s Supernatural.

SID: Hello. Sid Roth here. Welcome to my world where it’s naturally supernatural. My guest is Denny Cramer. And Denny, you know this. I am so intrigued with the gift that God has given you. He has prophesied over thousands of people for, what, some 33 years, and I had him prophesy over my staff last night and it’s, I don’t know, you’ve been doing it for so long. But I’m in awe of such a supernatural gift and the way it helps people. For instance, I have got a letter here from someone that he prophesied over. Let me just read a little bit of this. “You visited our congregation. I listened as you prophesied over many people I knew. It was amazing to me how accurate you were in speaking to their current circumstances and declaring over them their God-given potential, having never met them.” As a matter of fact, a lot of pastors are probably accused of telling you information because you’re so precise and so accurate. I imagine there are people that you probably couldn’t convince in a million years that you were tipped off by the pastor.

DENNY: Not in a million years.

SID: Let me keep reading this. “At the time of your visit I was in therapy at least twice a week due to post-traumatic stress disorder. I had been struggling with thoughts of suicide and depression, as well as a number of physical issues that were unresolved. The night before the service I woke up, yet again, at 3:15 a.m. and saw what I believe to be a big black bird that I knew must have been an evil spirit. The next day God spoke this to me through you.” This is so awesome. Listen to this. “You’ve also been tormented at night. A spirit comes into your bedroom around 3:00 in the morning, 3:15 in the morning and it begins to attack you with nightmares and health issues, pressure, stress and strain that lasts all day. And the last nine and a half months you’ve been saying, ‘I’m under attack.’ And no matter what you do you can’t get free. But the Lord says the breaker is here this morning. I am that breaker, Jesus, Jesus the Messiah, the Lord, and I snapped the neck of that spirit on assignment against you, and you will see a return of your physical health. Now every organ and every system will work as it was designed to work and you will sleep like a baby.” Then this person reports, “I have not been woken up at that time since. My health is back completely and I’ve not struggled with nightmares or stress.”

DENNY: Amazing.

SID: This has got to be, it’s amazing. It’s got to be so rewarding for you. Do you realize what it’s like for someone that is tormented night after night? You knew the exact time that the torment was going on. Does this happen often, people are sick, that you kind of, you know by your prophesy what the cause is and then you go after it?

DENNY: Absolutely. I go after it very aggressively. I know by the spirit of God whether it is just natural or whether there might even be a spiritual reason behind it, and I see it. I actually see these things on them, around them, in them. I know whether they came from their past. I know whether it’s just a present situation. I discern the spirit behind these situations. And in the case of this young married couple, they could not conceive. She was unable to have a child.

SID: I mean you took care of everything.

DENNY: I read her mail. I mean, the Holy Spirit went right down the line. I call prophesy, Sid, both diagnostic and prescriptive, in that God uses prophesy to diagnose problems and then He uses prophesy to prescribe the solution. So this couple was confirmed in their ministry as youth leaders. I didn’t know who they were, but God said, “Youth ministry, youth ministry, youth ministry.” I then saw the spirit coming into their bedroom around 3:15 in the morning, which was exactly when she would wake up with nightmares and fear, and dread, and cold sweats. I prophesied her body was being healed. They could not conceive and have a child. So she was being treated for all these things. But the Lord used prophecy diagnostically to diagnose their problems. Then He used prophesy to prescribe the solution. They were healed. They were delivered and the biggest miracle of all is that nine months later, in spite of what the doctor said, they had their baby.

SID: I love it. And as a matter of fact he prophesies what happens to countries. For instance, you prophesied the Afghan war. You prophesied the Indonesian earthquake. You prophesied the terrorist bombing in England. But I think you really get a lot of satisfaction prophesying things that help and encourage, and edify people. But I want to find out about how this gift started operating in you. You became a believer because you went to a Jesus freak meeting. Why did you go to a Jesus freak meeting?

DENNY: I moved in next door to some Jesus people. Didn’t know what they were, other than I had seen them on TV a little. And they gave me a Jesus paper, and the Jesus paper said the Jesus people are meeting Thursday night at such and such a location. I had an Irish Roman Catholic background. We went to church, went to Mass Sunday morning. That was it. But these Protestants, these Jesus people were having meetings Thursday night, which I thought was very bizarre. So I went in to a Jesus people meeting where these Jesus freaks or these Jesus people were having a meeting, and that’s when the spirit of God began to deal with me.

SID: It’s really funny. What did you think was going on with them when you looked at the younger people and the older people?

DENNY: Well having a bit of a drug background I thought they were all high. I mean, I legitimately went in and thought, well these young Jesus people with their guitars and their tambourines, and their long hair, and their jean jackets, they’re all smiling, they’re all happy. They must be high. But there was another segment of the church, the old Pentecostal folk, probably 80, 85 years of age, long-sleeved white shirts and dark trousers and dark shoes, very religious, they were all happy. They were all smiling. So I said I don’t understand this. How can
the old people be high? I had never seen happy old people.

SID: Then someone speaks in a supernatural language, and then they interpreted it. And what
did you think?

DENNY: Blew my mind. The guy was about ten feet away from me. He stood up and the whole church service sort of came to a stop and stands up and he gives this speech. To me, it was a speech in a language that I had never heard. And I went, oh, what was that about? Then to my left an old lady, an old lady, she stands up and she begins to speak in English. And I had never been exposed to this, but I knew that that lady was speaking in English what this man had just spoken in another language so that everyone in the room could get what God was saying. It was in fact tongues and interpretation to hear what Jesus had to say to us.

SID: To make a long story short, he is in the supernatural glory of God. He becomes a believer in the Messiah and then he’s downloaded with these gifts. We’ll pick up right here. Be right back.

SID: Hello, Sid Roth here with Jim Rutz and we’re talking about a mega trend, it is something that is bigger than all of us and it has got to do with the new, which was really
the old system called the house congregation. Now Jim, we were talking about the leader, and tell me who is the leader in a home church?

JIM: There are several leaders, we have distributed leadership, because if you put everything into one person then pretty soon the authority, the thought, everything is flowing down from the top. In the New Testament leaders are supposed to be at the
bottom of that pyramid, supporting everybody else. If you go around the traditional churches and ask people, “Are you there in that church to support the vision and
ministry of the pastor, or is the pastor there to support you in your own personal ministry?” Everyone would say the same thing.

SID: But how could a large church, how in the world can the pastor support the individual vision, he may have the heart to do it, but unless they are supporting
his vision it’s just not going to happen.

JIM: Bingo. That’s it!

SID: So what would you say the real difference is between the house church and the traditional church?

JIM: It’s your identity, it’s your relationship, Sid if you and I were in a house church we would belong to each other, it’s really kind of a 24-7 thing rather than a Sunday go to meeting thing, not that there is anything wrong at all with meeting on Sundays but if you’ve got a problem, I’ve got a problem, and I don’t rest until your problem is solved, and if somebody is after SID Roth or trying to put you down or attack you in some way, they are going to have to get past me first, because I am there to cover you and you are there to cover me, we belong to each other. You know you can’t buy that kind of loyalty these days. And so that is why house churches are growing, people are really hungry for that kind of belonging and responsibility and accountability, if I see you slipping off the track and starting to do some things that are wrong, I am going to take you aside and say, “Sid, this is not good in your life.”

SID: What goes on in a house church?

JIM: Almost everything, the fun thing is you can never know what is happening, when you open it up and the Holy Spirit is in charge, Yeshua is there, Jesus is there, and you might kind of have a habit of say starting off with some singing, but beyond that there is hardly any time, people don’t plan these things

SID: How long have you been going to house churches?

JIM: Various things that look like house churches for several decades, it’s evolving.

SID: How long have you been researching this whole subject?
JIM: Oh, fifteen years or something like that.

SID: It’s, you know this book MegaShift, that tells exactly how they can establish this kind of a house church, but how can you be different every week, I mean everyone falls into patterns.

JIM: Well, I’m a creative guy, but if I had to create fifty-two different programs for fifty-two different meetings, I couldn’t do it, but the Holy Spirit somehow manages to take all the threads of what people have been thinking about and doing all week and drawing it together like a conductor waving a baton, things weave together and you say a scripture verse and that reminds me of something in my life which inspires somebody else to pray something and somebody else thinks of a song out of that and it just flows

SID: But who gives the message?

JIM: The message, the message

SID: Yes.

JIM: Okay, there’s the problem Sid, a sermon arose, over a couple of hundred years or so it became a…I stand up and I talk and you set there and you listen.

SID: Just a couple of hundred years ago?

JIM: Well no, through the first two hundred years of the church service developed, we don’t have that, we have a lot of people bringing a lot of messages, and so even if you are a new Christian you are going to learn to open up your Bible and say, “You know I was reading in this book called Galatians, Galatians, and God spoke to me and said this verse here last week, you know.” and so even new Christians are able to start ministering.
We had a meeting just south of Colorado Springs, Pueblo, Colorado, years ago, a friend of my had fallen and broken her ankle into a million pieces, it was terrible, and so they
gathered around, “Let’s pray for Jeanie,” and so they all came around and put hands on Jeanie and here is this two year old boy named Moses, from across the room walks over, puts his little two-year-old hands around her ankle and everybody in the room hears all these bones snapping back into place, two-years-old. So everybody gets involved, it is not longer a case of who brings “the message” or who is the leader?

SID: So no one could be hidden, no one could be behind the back of someone is what you’re saying.

JIM: It’s pretty hard with ten or twelve or fifteen.

SID: Now the ennis, the truth, you’ve been going to these meeting for many, many, years, is there a sense of excitement before you go to a meeting really and truly? It’s not the same old, same old, it’s not routine as usual.

JIM: Not even close to same old, same old, if you have a bunch of people who know how to listen to the Holy Spirit then it is going to be different every time. The Holy Spirit doesn’t deal in cookie cutter programs. Programs, we say are for people who don’t know how to listen to God.

SID: Say that statement again.

JIM: Programs are for people who don’t know how to listen to the Holy Spirit.

SID: Jim, as you know God has had me teaching on the one new man, and the one new man if I had to come up with a word to describe it, there are many things, but the one word, if they forced me to come up with the one word of what it is, it’s freedom, and I did an experiment recently, went into my own home town, I rented a hotel room, I just put the chairs in a circular, with concentric circles, one time I did a rectangle, one time with
Concentric rectangles, we had anywhere from a hundred and fifty to two hundred people at both of these meetings and I said the hardest things that I am going to do is to keep quiet, I don’t know if you can relate.

JIM: That’s hard.

SID: But it was very, very difficult for me, now the hardest thing that you are going to do
is to talk, because you are so used to being a spectator.

JIM: Yes, yes.

SID: Well, it started out a little rough, but then one person had courage to stand up and so you know that it was so wonderful, I mean a man gets up, someone I don’t even know, should I give him permission, should I not give him permission, and he says he was in a mental institution and God gave him some songs and Jesus came in and He became real to him and He took over his life and he sits down. So I said, he didn’t have a guitar, I said, someone hand him a guitar, talk about risk taking, so he takes this guitar, and I have to tell you Jim, the Spirit of God just flowed into that auditorium, wasn’t even an auditorium, that hotel room, like a river. The leaders didn’t sit together, the worship team wasn’t there because the worship team were the people with the guitars and violins and banners and tambourines and shofars, and at one point the Spirit of God moved into that
meeting in such a tangible fashion that has never happened in my life, my hands literally started burning and Jim I knew that I could lay hands on people and they would be healed, but I knew God didn’t want me to, it was like a sign to tell me that God was ready
to heal Himself, no one laid hands on anyone, I said to someone who I didn’t even know, “Stand up and pray a blanket prayer over everyone.” And they prayed that prayer and guess what, there were half a dozen miracles, I mean genuine miracles, I mean someone who had parachuted from a plane and landed badly with broken everything got instantly healed. And then the next meeting we had we expected the same thing, no, God had an entirely different plan and this wasn’t a house meeting, this was a larger meeting, I mean it is so exciting because you don’t know what God is going to do.

JIM: Yes it’s an open meeting; He is the God of surprises.

SID: What will happen if someone reads Mega Shift?

JIM: Well hopefully his life will get changed and he will realize who he really is, he will have a new identity, or she will be able to do things that they have never done before.
It doesn’t mean that tomorrow morning you step out the door and heal everybody in sight but it gives you a great starting point and you learn to grow, and you are not doing it alone anymore, because you will have people around you that are praying for you, supporting you, and helping you.

SID: Listen, this is another significant, mentoring tool for the next, for the greatest, and I believe for the last move of God’s Spirit before the Messiah returns. You have been wondering what am I going to do, I would like to have a house congregation, I don’t know how to do it, this book will show you how to do it, and then just do the stuff, it’s that simple, but listen, you could go to another country with this principle and probably start a thousand congregations, women over eighty years of age are doing this in other countries, read it in this book. Jim Rutz, thank you for writing this, thank you for your years of research in this, but I really believe that this is a “how to” manual.

JIM: It is.

SID: So just take it in their hands and get a baby. It’s that simple, and get right with God.

SID: So in other words what He said is when the leaders, the Sanhedrin, say “Blessed is he who comes in the name of the Lord,” Jesus will be here. That’s quite a nuance; difference.

PAUL: Well, they disappeared. Here’s the exciting thing. And it’s happened right under the noses of most Bible believers, and they don’t even know it’s happened. At the end of 2004, 71 elders calling themselves the revived Sanhedrin approached the Knesset and said “We are now here. We’re back. We’re the rulers.” They disappeared for over 1,700 years. 1,700 years – No longer as a ruling body; and reappeared at the end of 2004.

SID: I don’t have to be a mental giant – you don’t have to be a mental giant to figure that out. They’re here now. They’re ready to say “Blessed is he who comes in the name of the Lord.” And Jesus will be here. Miracles: next segment. Trust me – don’t go away. Be right back after this. 

SID: Sid Roth here with Paul Wilbur, messianic Jewish psalmist. And it’s one thing when Paul goes to a nation like Zambia and sees miracles – which he did. Tumors drop off. But what happens when he’s just worshipping God in a church in Miami. What happens Paul?

PAUL: Well, there was a very spectacular presence of the living God. In Psalm 22:3, God promises, through King David, “I inhabit the praises of My people.” So if we will just put ourselves in an attitude of praise, He comes where we are. Now when we were in Miami, we were doing just that: A couple thousand Gypsies. These are Romanian immigrants that have come to the United States, they’ve got their own culture and language. And in about the second song, Sid, the Lord spoke to my heart and said “I don’t want to hear any more about My power. I want to demonstrate it now.” And that really kind of shook me, because I didn’t know what was going to happen. And then I understood that I should speak about healing, so I stopped the music. I told the people “The Lord is here to heal you.” and we had about four blind eyes and four or five deaf ears, in Miami, Florida, came open in a Sunday morning church service. The place just exploded.

SID: Listen. Paul Wilbur and his wife are quite a team. I just wish his wife, Luanne, would work on cue. She doesn’t. She can only speak when God speaks to her. But I was having dinner with Paul and all of a sudden, I see her go like this to his shoulder, and she starts speaking in an unknown language and he starts translating. Paul, you told me that you were talking to someone on the phone who had cancer, and what happened?

PAUL: They were healed. My wife and I were out to lunch. This is a good Presbyterian girl, you know, but God’s just gotten a hold of her. We were out to lunch, sitting by the beach, enjoying a nice afternoon, a friend of mine called. He said “We’re going to Milwaukee to have testing for cancer. I’ve been told I have this cancer and that cancer.” My wife pulled on my sleeve…

SID: I know that sign now.

PAUL: …And she had a message for him. I got the interpretation, declared to him that he’s healed, that the Lord is going to prove it to him. He called me two weeks later and said “I’m completely free. No cancer.” It’s just wonderful.

SID: Listen, that’s just wonderful for him, but what about you? Some of you are saying “What about me?” I believe, as Paul Wilbur sings from his new album, “Holy, Holy, Holy,” as you reach your heart up to God, miracles will break out. Get ready. Paul, go over there.

§ music §

Holy, holy, holy is the God of Israel Elders bow in worship as the angel voices swell Rain clouds of incense swirl around Your throne of grace Lord, we bow in worship at the brilliance of Your face We cry holy Holy Holy Is the Lord Holy Angels cry holy The Lord, He is holy Holy is the Lord You are the Lord’s There’s none like You, Lord Who is like You, oh Lord, among the gods? Holy, holy, holy is the song that heaven sings All creation praise Him, Hallelujah Elohim Come to reign forever, King Of Kings and Lord Of Lords Hill of Zion, open wide you ancient doors And cry holy Holy Holy is the Lord Holy Holy Holy is the Lord Of Lords Holy is the Lord, righteous and mighty Holy is the Lord Holy, holy The God who’s healing us You ever listen when we call You here Holy is the Lord

§ music § 

SID: The great Jewish prophet, Isaiah, caught a glimpse of God, and he said “Holy, holy, holy, is the Lord God Almighty. He’s high and lifted up, and His train fills the temple.” But then he says “Woe is me! I’m undone! I’ve seen the Lord.” And he recognized his sin. He recognized that all of his righteousness counted for nothing. Compared to another man it counted a great deal, but compared to God that he caught a glimpse of… God you’re so good. You’re so good. If you will turn from your sins, our good God will cover them with His blood. And He says, even more than cover, He will remove those sins in the name of Jesus. In the act of… Paul, God is telling you something.

PAUL: Yes. There’s someone listening to you right now, Sid, and they’re saying “I wish I knew that this was real.” And the Lord is going to confirm this to you, because you have tumors in your stomach; a lot of acid and a lot of discomfort. And the Lord is healing those right now as a sign to you that you are loved of God and can be saved. There’s someone else Sid that’s listening right now that has an issue of blood. There’s a loss of energy and a loss of vitality, and the doctors don’t know what to do; but there’s a leaking of blood somewhere internally in you that the doctors haven’t found, and the Lord is healing that for you right now because He loves you.

SID: Other miracles are happening right now too. Spines – they’re literally being repaired. Bend over, you’ll see there’s no pain in the neck, no pain in your neck, your back. And hip – if you’ll stand up and just jump, you’ll see that that pain is totally gone. This is your moment. What are you going to do about it? Are you going to say “Oh, I’ll just look at something else on TV”? Or are you going to have an encounter with the Living God? Choose this day whom you shall serve, but as for me and my house, we’re going to serve the Living God. I want you to be part of the mishpochah; that’s a Hebrew word, it means ‘family’. I want you part of God’s family. Why would you want to walk around like a blind man, when you can see? In Jesus’ name, repent to your sins, and believe that He is your Lord. Ask Him to forgive your sins and live inside of you. 

SID: So in other words what He said is when the leaders, the Sanhedrin, say “Blessed is he who comes in the name of the Lord,” Jesus will be here. That’s quite a nuance; difference.

PAUL: Well, they disappeared. Here’s the exciting thing. And it’s happened right under the noses of most Bible believers, and they don’t even know it’s happened. At the end of 2004, 71 elders calling themselves the revived Sanhedrin approached the Knesset and said “We are now here. We’re back. We’re the rulers.” They disappeared for over 1,700 years. 1,700 years – No longer as a ruling body; and reappeared at the end of 2004.

SID: I don’t have to be a mental giant – you don’t have to be a mental giant to figure that out. They’re here now. They’re ready to say “Blessed is he who comes in the name of the Lord.” And Jesus will be here. Miracles: next segment. Trust me – don’t go away. Be right back after this. 

SID: Sid Roth here with Paul Wilbur, messianic Jewish psalmist. And it’s one thing when Paul goes to a nation like Zambia and sees miracles – which he did. Tumors drop off. But what happens when he’s just worshipping God in a church in Miami. What happens Paul?

PAUL: Well, there was a very spectacular presence of the living God. In Psalm 22:3, God promises, through King David, “I inhabit the praises of My people.” So if we will just put ourselves in an attitude of praise, He comes where we are. Now when we were in Miami, we were doing just that: A couple thousand Gypsies. These are Romanian immigrants that have come to the United States, they’ve got their own culture and language. And in about the second song, Sid, the Lord spoke to my heart and said “I don’t want to hear any more about My power. I want to demonstrate it now.” And that really kind of shook me, because I didn’t know what was going to happen. And then I understood that I should speak about healing, so I stopped the music. I told the people “The Lord is here to heal you.” and we had about four blind eyes and four or five deaf ears, in Miami, Florida, came open in a Sunday morning church service. The place just exploded.

SID: Listen. Paul Wilbur and his wife are quite a team. I just wish his wife, Luanne, would work on cue. She doesn’t. She can only speak when God speaks to her. But I was having dinner with Paul and all of a sudden, I see her go like this to his shoulder, and she starts speaking in an unknown language and he starts translating. Paul, you told me that you were talking to someone on the phone who had cancer, and what happened?

PAUL: They were healed. My wife and I were out to lunch. This is a good Presbyterian girl, you know, but God’s just gotten a hold of her. We were out to lunch, sitting by the beach, enjoying a nice afternoon, a friend of mine called. He said “We’re going to Milwaukee to have testing for cancer. I’ve been told I have this cancer and that cancer.” My wife pulled on my sleeve…

SID: I know that sign now.

PAUL: …And she had a message for him. I got the interpretation, declared to him that he’s healed, that the Lord is going to prove it to him. He called me two weeks later and said “I’m completely free. No cancer.” It’s just wonderful.

SID: Listen, that’s just wonderful for him, but what about you? Some of you are saying “What about me?” I believe, as Paul Wilbur sings from his new album, “Holy, Holy, Holy,” as you reach your heart up to God, miracles will break out. Get ready. Paul, go over there.

§ music §

Holy, holy, holy is the God of Israel Elders bow in worship as the angel voices swell Rain clouds of incense swirl around Your throne of grace Lord, we bow in worship at the brilliance of Your face We cry holy Holy Holy Is the Lord Holy Angels cry holy The Lord, He is holy Holy is the Lord You are the Lord’s There’s none like You, Lord Who is like You, oh Lord, among the gods? Holy, holy, holy is the song that heaven sings All creation praise Him, Hallelujah Elohim Come to reign forever, King Of Kings and Lord Of Lords Hill of Zion, open wide you ancient doors And cry holy Holy Holy is the Lord Holy Holy Holy is the Lord Of Lords Holy is the Lord, righteous and mighty Holy is the Lord Holy, holy The God who’s healing us You ever listen when we call You here Holy is the Lord

SID: The great Jewish prophet, Isaiah, caught a glimpse of God, and he said “Holy, holy, holy, is the Lord God Almighty. He’s high and lifted up, and His train fills the temple.” But then he says “Woe is me! I’m undone! I’ve seen the Lord.” And he recognized his sin. He recognized that all of his righteousness counted for nothing. Compared to another man it counted a great deal, but compared to God that he caught a glimpse of… God you’re so good. You’re so good. If you will turn from your sins, our good God will cover them with His blood. And He says, even more than cover, He will remove those sins in the name of Jesus. In the act of… Paul, God is telling you something.

PAUL: Yes. There’s someone listening to you right now, Sid, and they’re saying “I wish I knew that this was real.” And the Lord is going to confirm this to you, because you have tumors in your stomach; a lot of acid and a lot of discomfort. And the Lord is healing those right now as a sign to you that you are loved of God and can be saved. There’s someone else Sid that’s listening right now that has an issue of blood. There’s a loss of energy and a loss of vitality, and the doctors don’t know what to do; but there’s a leaking of blood somewhere internally in you that the doctors haven’t found, and the Lord is healing that for you right now because He loves you.

SID: Other miracles are happening right now too. Spines – they’re literally being repaired. Bend over, you’ll see there’s no pain in the neck, no pain in your neck, your back. And hip – if you’ll stand up and just jump, you’ll see that that pain is totally gone. This is your moment. What are you going to do about it? Are you going to say “Oh, I’ll just look at something else on TV”? Or are you going to have an encounter with the Living God? Choose this day whom you shall serve, but as for me and my house, we’re going to serve the Living God. I want you to be part of the mishpochah; that’s a Hebrew word, it means ‘family’. I want you part of God’s family. Why would you want to walk around like a blind man, when you can see? In Jesus’ name, repent to your sins, and believe that He is your Lord. Ask Him to forgive your sins and live inside of you.

SID: Sid Roth here with Paul Wilbur. Paul is not a worship leader, he is a new covenant prophetic psalmist. And you said, Paul, that God had shown you that this is a year of breakthrough. What does that mean to you?

PAUL: Its bars of iron that are cut; its double doors of bronze that have been closed to us before; new opportunities to share the goodness of God. Later on this year, I’ll take a large team with me to Zambia in Africa, at the invitation of the President.

PAUL: Now you were recently in Zambia, and they had…

SID: You’re talking about breakthroughs. They had breakthroughs.

PAUL: They did. In fact, while we were there, the Vice-President of the nation receive Yeshua – received Jesus as his Lord and Savior. So for that nation, you know, as the head goes, so goes the rest of the body. I’m very excited for Zambia, because they are lining themselves up now for the blessings of God.

SID: Tell me about the country. How bad off are they?

PAUL: It’s exceptionally bad. They are the second or third poorest nation in the world, perhaps behind Ethiopia and Sudan. The average Zambian does not make it to their 40th birthday. They have the second highest incidence of AIDS. One-tenth; over one-tenth,

SID. If you think about this, over one-tenth of their population are orphans that live on the streets. We fed some of these children. The most fortunate of them get one bowl of porridge from a caring church, a congregation there in the nation, one time a day, and most of the time just five days a week. But most of those children go to bed hungry; begging on streets, living in garbage traps. The poverty is staggering. And I found out, one of the reasons for the great turnaround, when this nation became a nation back in 1972, the first thing their first president did was sever diplomatic relations with Israel – His first act as president.

SID: My goodness. Now we know Genesis 12:3, God says “I’ll bless those who bless the Jewish people, I’ll curse those who curse them.” I mean this is a graphic illustration of that.

PAUL: Absolutely. Now they have, for the last two presidents, including this one, they’re born-again Christians. They have reestablished diplomatic relationships with Israel and declared that Zambia is a Christian nation. They’ve dedicated the nation to the Lord. Imagine if our President did that: Stood up at a State of the Union address and said “I’m dedicating the United States to the Lord.”

SID: You told me what happened to a Muslim mosque in Zambia. What happened?

PAUL: Phenomenal. Now isn’t it wonderful, that when we do just what God shows us to do, He adds the power to it. If we lay hands on the sick like He says, people get healed. Well, the Bible says to take care of orphans and widows in their distress, and Zambia has more than their share.

SID: Of course.

PAUL: So this young messianic believer went out to feed street children one day, and he set up his shop right next to a Muslim mosque. And from the safety of the mosque, the imam – the pastor or the rabbi if you will – was watching, and he was very curious as to why these people fed everybody. They fed Muslims, they fed Christians, they fed children, they fed anybody who was hungry. And finally the imam couldn’t take it any longer. He walked out… Now I heard this first-hand from the man. This is almost too hard to believe, but it’s so good. He walked out to talk with this young messianic believer, and he said “I’ve just got to know, why do you feed everybody? We Muslims, we only feed our people.” And so this young man shared the love of God and some scripture with him. The imam repented right there, received Jesus as Lord of his life. Then, the next day, called a meeting for his entire mosque. Five hundred showed up. He’s one day old in the Lord. He gave his testimony, and over two hundred of those people received the Lord, went down to the crocodile-infested river – this separates the men from the boys. If you’re going to get a mikvah and there’s crocodiles watching, this means you’re serious. And over two hundred of them were baptized or mikvahed that day. And they went up and took the crescent off the top of the mosque and put a star of David on the side.

SID: Could you picture, if ever mosque in, say, London, England, that happened to? Do you know there are more mosques in London, England today than churches? Could you picture if that happened in the United States and in Europe? Paul, there’s something going on with Israel. There’s something new going on. I think it’s got to do with that word breakthrough that you used. What is going on that you see in this area?

PAUL: Well, there’s a new desire, there’s a fresh hunger, I believe, for the presence of God, and for knowing who is the God of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob. Remember, Esther said that she was brought to the kingdom… Or Mordecai said to her “You’ve been brought to the kingdom for such a time as this.” I believe that a lot of Israelis are wondering “What time is it?” They hear a lot in Christian broadcasting, and from the many tourists that come through. But something happened at the end of 2004, Sid, which also puts it… In Matthew 23, Yeshua said to Jerusalem “You’ll not see Me again until you say ‘Blessed is he who comes.'” Now was He speaking to all Israel? Certainly He was. Was He speaking just to Jerusalem? Well, no. If you read it carefully, He says “I wanted to gather your chicks together, but you were not willing, and you will not see Me again until you say…” See, I believe He was speaking directly to the leaders, the 71 elders, the Sanhedrin, the Pharisees, and the Sadducees. 

SID: Sid Roth here with Paul Wilbur. Paul is not a worship leader, he is a new covenant prophetic psalmist. And you said, Paul, that God had shown you that this is a year of breakthrough. What does that mean to you?

PAUL: Its bars of iron that are cut; its double doors of bronze that have been closed to us before; new opportunities to share the goodness of God. Later on this year, I’ll take a large team with me to Zambia in Africa, at the invitation of the President.

PAUL: Now you were recently in Zambia, and they had…

SID: You’re talking about breakthroughs. They had breakthroughs.

PAUL: They did. In fact, while we were there, the Vice-President of the nation receive Yeshua – received Jesus as his Lord and Savior. So for that nation, you know, as the head goes, so goes the rest of the body. I’m very excited for Zambia, because they are lining themselves up now for the blessings of God.

SID: Tell me about the country. How bad off are they?

PAUL: It’s exceptionally bad. They are the second or third poorest nation in the world, perhaps behind Ethiopia and Sudan. The average Zambian does not make it to their 40th birthday. They have the second highest incidence of AIDS. One-tenth; over one-tenth,

SID. If you think about this, over one-tenth of their population are orphans that live on the streets. We fed some of these children. The most fortunate of them get one bowl of porridge from a caring church, a congregation there in the nation, one time a day, and most of the time just five days a week. But most of those children go to bed hungry; begging on streets, living in garbage traps. The poverty is staggering. And I found out, one of the reasons for the great turnaround, when this nation became a nation back in 1972, the first thing their first president did was sever diplomatic relations with Israel – His first act as president.

SID: My goodness. Now we know Genesis 12:3, God says “I’ll bless those who bless the Jewish people, I’ll curse those who curse them.” I mean this is a graphic illustration of that.

PAUL: Absolutely. Now they have, for the last two presidents, including this one, they’re born-again Christians. They have reestablished diplomatic relationships with Israel and declared that Zambia is a Christian nation. They’ve dedicated the nation to the Lord. Imagine if our President did that: Stood up at a State of the Union address and said “I’m dedicating the United States to the Lord.”

SID: You told me what happened to a Muslim mosque in Zambia. What happened?

PAUL: Phenomenal. Now isn’t it wonderful, that when we do just what God shows us to do, He adds the power to it. If we lay hands on the sick like He says, people get healed. Well, the Bible says to take care of orphans and widows in their distress, and Zambia has more than their share.

SID: Of course.

PAUL: So this young messianic believer went out to feed street children one day, and he set up his shop right next to a Muslim mosque. And from the safety of the mosque, the imam – the pastor or the rabbi if you will – was watching, and he was very curious as to why these people fed everybody. They fed Muslims, they fed Christians, they fed children, they fed anybody who was hungry. And finally the imam couldn’t take it any longer. He walked out… Now I heard this first-hand from the man. This is almost too hard to believe, but it’s so good. He walked out to talk with this young messianic believer, and he said “I’ve just got to know, why do you feed everybody? We Muslims, we only feed our people.” And so this young man shared the love of God and some scripture with him. The imam repented right there, received Jesus as Lord of his life. Then, the next day, called a meeting for his entire mosque. Five hundred showed up. He’s one day old in the Lord. He gave his testimony, and over two hundred of those people received the Lord, went down to the crocodile-infested river – this separates the men from the boys. If you’re going to get a mikvah and there’s crocodiles watching, this means you’re serious. And over two hundred of them were baptized or mikvahed that day. And they went up and took the crescent off the top of the mosque and put a star of David on the side.

SID: Could you picture, if ever mosque in, say, London, England, that happened to? Do you know there are more mosques in London, England today than churches? Could you picture if that happened in the United States and in Europe? Paul, there’s something going on with Israel. There’s something new going on. I think it’s got to do with that word breakthrough that you used. What is going on that you see in this area?

PAUL: Well, there’s a new desire, there’s a fresh hunger, I believe, for the presence of God, and for knowing who is the God of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob. Remember, Esther said that she was brought to the kingdom… Or Mordecai said to her “You’ve been brought to the kingdom for such a time as this.” I believe that a lot of Israelis are wondering “What time is it?” They hear a lot in Christian broadcasting, and from the many tourists that come through. But something happened at the end of 2004, Sid, which also puts it… In Matthew 23, Yeshua said to Jerusalem “You’ll not see Me again until you say ‘Blessed is he who comes.'” Now was He speaking to all Israel? Certainly He was. Was He speaking just to Jerusalem? Well, no. If you read it carefully, He says “I wanted to gather your chicks together, but you were not willing, and you will not see Me again until you say…” See, I believe He was speaking directly to the leaders, the 71 elders, the Sanhedrin, the Pharisees, and the Sadducees.