Sid:  My guest is red hot for the Messiah his name if Matt Sorger. I’m speaking to him at his office in Long Island, New York.  And on yesterday’s broadcast Matt we found out you came from a Catholic background, you weren’t particularly religious at all.  Your mother was very very sick, and she went to a Catholic Charismatic meeting, she literally got thrown in the air with the power of God ten feet, electric bolts went through her.  She came home, you were just fourteen years of age, but you recognized something different happened. Then the next day or so, after what happened to your mom being, I mean a major miracle happening in her life, you all received the Messiah.  You went to church, but you had a problem, the problem you had is when you weren’t in church you didn’t have that same good feeling of the Holy Spirit that you had in the local nondenominational church your family started going to.  So you got a worship music, you went into your bedroom, how long did it take before you felt anything while you were worshipping God in your bedroom every night?

Matt:  Sid it was about four months where…

Sid:  How did you stick it out for four months as a young kid?

Matt:  You see you know it’s funny I was just, I was just being drawn by God that it didn’t necessarily matter what I felt or what I didn’t feel, although I wanted to feel God in a greater way yet I was so hungry for Him it didn’t matter.  So I was just, I was just determined that I was going to walk with God and develop this relationship with Him; and you know I would get my worship music and I’d sing the songs, then I’d have my prayer time. I was just brand new saved and all this Holy Spirit stuff was very very new for me.  But I’ll never forget the day I was standing in my bedroom singing the same song I’d sung thousands of times probably before.

Sid:  You said you had just one CD.

Matt:  Yeah, my one little Hosanna worship tape, and I played it over and over and over again. I’m standing in my room and my hands are lifted up now and I’m singing the song it was like heaven opened up over me in my room.  And I physically felt something come from over my head, it came over my body and then the whole room it was like whoosh it just filled the whole room. This tangible glory just broke open and my whole room became filled with God, I became filled with God in such a tangible way that that something that day broke through; and from that moment, literally from that moment, from that second forward in my relationship with God.  Every time I would just whisper the name of Jesus Holy Spirit would show up in the same way, whether I was alone, whether I was with people in church, that same presence would come upon me.  And sometimes actually it would come even stronger when I was alone.

Sid:  Now tell me about the time the Holy Spirit told you to dance.

Matt:  Okay we’re going to fast forward a few years when I was pastoring now. I was three years in college, and you know going to study to be a doctor and going premed and you know had certain plans and then the Lord called me to full time ministry.  And I remember…

Sid:  It’s interesting you were interested in medicine in the natural as well as the spiritual.

Matt:  Yeah, well you know what it was my heart always was to do something for God. I wanted to help people; you know that was just something God put in me.  And you know everyone always says you have to you know go to school, get a good education; not that I’m not saying to do that, but this was, that was the normal pattern that everyone walks through.  So that’s what I was doing because I didn’t know to do anything else until God spoke to me about ministry, and then He began to you know really confirm to my heart that He had called me full time to preach the word and to you know serve Him.  Now at this point I had gone through Bible school, and then became a pastor on staff at a church in New York. I was pastoring for about five years and I was really hungry for God Sid.  You know when we were talking before about when I first joined church and I would get frustrated because this whole thing is connected, I would get frustrated when I would pray for people.  Eventually I started to pray for people but I saw nothing happening you know I would pray for someone and they wouldn’t get healed, I would pray for someone and there was no anointing.

Sid:  Listen, I’m must have healing lines of fifty people and nothing would happen, I don’t know how I did it, I don’t know how you kept up.

Matt:  Yeah, you know but I would say to people, and this was when I was a teenager I would say to people I’d say, “Something is wrong, I said when I pray for someone I want something to happen.”  And it became a humorous thing like even if their little pinky shakes, you know something, I just want something to happen to this person when I pray for them. You know, I don’t want it to be like praying over a dead stone you know, you know laying empty hands on an empty head you know; I want something to transpire.  I remember I started to get real desperate so now at this point I’m just spending hours and hours and hours and hours in the presence of God. I know sometimes peoples schedules and I’m not saying that God does it the same way with everybody, but for me this was what God was doing in me.  And I just found myself the time increasing that I was spending with the Lord and the presence of the Holy Spirit was growing and increasing in my life. All of a sudden as this was happening, I kept praying for people and then the glory and the anointing that I was experiencing alone with God now suddenly began to overflow and started to flow through me to touch other people.  And I remember when people starting falling over, you know back then in the church where I was at it wasn’t necessarily a common thing to see people falling over, or to see you know demonstration of the Holy Spirit, it was not a normal thing.  So when it started to happen I was surprised by it but I wasn’t totally unfamiliar because I knew what had happened to my mom when she first got healed the power of God knocked her over.  So I knew that kind of thing happened, but I remember as I started to pray for people things started happening. It was a direct result of the overflow of the presence of God that I was experiencing in my bedroom and in my alone time with Him.  It started to flow through me now to touch other people. You know this was still in my teen years and we hadn’t necessarily stepped full time into what I would consider a healing ministry, but things were happening, people were getting delivered, people were getting set free.  I remember praying as a teenager for another young man who was in the youth group and he was bound by drugs and alcohol and all this addiction. Sid I didn’t know what to do, I didn’t know how to pray all I knew to do was to call on the name of Jesus.  So I remember sitting with a group of all the young people and just putting my hand on his shoulder and calling out to Jesus and saying “Jesus, set him free with the blood of Jesus.”  And I just kept saying the blood of Jesus, and all of a sudden, again, the power of God came and hit this kid so hard he jumped out of his seat started screaming and he started running all around his house screaming, “I’m free, I’m free.” All the bondages and addiction that was on his life instantly broke off and he was set totally free.  And I remember those times starting to see that anointing and that flow of God really be released in people’s lives.

Sid:  Now what you’re telling me is that by spending time with God the power was accumulating within you to a point where it exploded.

Matt:  That’s what happened, yeah that’s exactly what happened. I think the breakthrough happened in me you know because I think as I was spending time with God my spirit man was becoming more full of Holy Spirit, and then eventually it became so full that it just had to overflow.  And then power and everything else out flowed with it was just a natural byproduct of the intimacy that I was experiencing with God.  And then it just kept increasing and the awesome thing about God is that you don’t have to just hit one level it can be ever increasing and ever growing.  So I remember you know following God, and you know stepping into full time ministry and He led me to become a pastor for about five years.  I pastored out a church here in New York, and at that point it was probably in the fifth year I was doing you know the regular pastoral duties. But then something else started to happen in my heart and God started to really stir in me a vision for mass miracles and a vision to see multitudes healed, saved, delivered, you know, I started to see these crowds in my mind.  I started to see these crowds of thousands of people. I started to see these miracles, and I started to see, you know, this outpouring of the Holy Spirit and it was something of a vision God was putting on me and inside of me. I found myself so much more hungry now for the healing power to see signs and wonders and miracles.  And you know there are those moments of divine encounter that will change your life forever. I remember it was a Monday morning in the church, and one of my jobs as an associate pastor was to help process the offerings from the Sunday mornings services, and we would do that on Monday morning.  So I was in the church, it was like 9:00 in the morning, and we’re counting the money and it’s just like every other day and as I’m counting Holy Spirit from inside of me, from deep down inside of me, I feel something rising up on the inside of me.  And I hear the voice of God speak to me and He says “Matt, I want you to get up and begin to dance right now.”  And in my natural mind it didn’t totally compute, I said, I thought to myself, “Why would I dance now?”  You know there’s no music, it’s not a service, we’re just doing administrative work, but I could ignore it and it got stronger and stronger and stronger and stronger.

Sid:  Matt, I’ll tell you what, hold that thought we’ll pickup right here on tomorrow’s broadcast.  But I am very excited about the teaching gift that God has given you because when it comes to healing, when it comes to miracles, there’s a lot of confusion out there and there are a lot of people unlike you did not breakthrough they started and the baby was aborted. Well tell me the results of what people say when they sit under your teaching?

Matt:  Yeah, well you know you people will know the truth and the truth sets them free and part of being used by God is knowing the truth; and in this particular teaching series we have on created miracles you know really we’re not teaching something that we know is a good idea.  We’re teaching something that we’ve lived and we’ve experienced, such as God reforming eardrums on the inside of people’s heads and you know opening up deaf ears.

Sid:  But you know what I love is after the teaching which settles the argument then comes the good stuff, the impartation.

Matt:  Yeah, and that you know it’s information and it’s impartation.

Sid:  Now my guest is red hot for the Messiah. His name if Matt Sorger, and when he was fourteen years of age he was Catholic just going to church every once in a great while.  God didn’t mean a whole lot to him certainly, not in a personal way, but he had a problem his mother got very sick.  What happened to your mom Matt?  

Matt:  Hey Sid, yeah my mom had come down with multiple infirmities and sicknesses. She was visiting doctors every week and she had a rack of medicines.  She was up to about twenty-four bottles of different kinds of medication and medicines that she had to take every day. By the time two years had passed by and she really was searching for a way to be healed.  And she was searching for truth, but she just found herself getting worse and worse and worse. Until one night two years into it she was laying in bed and my grandmother invites her, you know she sees a flyer for a Catholic charismatic healing mass taking place at the Catholic Church near our home here in Long Island, New York.  And this was probably about twenty years ago now. So she invited my mom to this Catholic healing service where they were praying for the sick.  And my mom was at the point where she had gone the root of medicine, she had gone the root of doctors; her sickness was they could not cure it, they couldn’t help her. They diagnosed her with all these different things and were giving all these medications and nothing was working she just kept getting worse and worse.  So my grandmother sees this healing mass, invites my mom to it so they go. You know Sid it’s funny that that night that my mom went to the healing mass she was the sickest that she had ever been in her whole life.

Sid:  It was almost as if the devil knew that his time was up and he was giving it all he was worth.

Matt:  That’s exactly it and she was determined to get there and she physically dragged her body to that church that night. You know it’s true right before our greatest breakthrough is the greatest battle and that’s exactly what was happening.  And my Mom walked into that church and she just crumbled on the back floor of the sanctuary in a puddle on the floor crying, just broken, a very broken person. You know from that place she looked up and she saw the cross hanging there and she just prayed a very simple prayer to God.  She said, “Jesus tonight I’m coming back to You, I’m coming to You and I’m putting my faith in You.” She got up off the floor and she started walking down you know the center aisle of the church where the priests were praying for the folks up in the front. The priests went to go anoint her with oil and before he could even get his hand on her to pray for her the Holy Spirit overshadowed her body, and literally threw her body ten feet back through the air across the altar and she landed back on the floor.  And you know she had never seen anything like this before, heard anything like this happening to anybody you know it was a very quiet meeting.  It was not a very emotional meeting you know it was very quiet and subdued but yet right in that place the power of the Holy Spirit overshadowed her.  It was her time it was her moment; she had called out to the Lord and God now was revealing truth to her not only that He was her Savior, but her healer as well.  And you know when she was laying on the floor she could feel like these bolts of electricity flowing through her body, and she was so caught up that she thought she was in heaven, it was that extreme of an encounter with God.  She didn’t know if she was still here on the earth or maybe she died and went to heaven, but it was, it was an extreme power encounter with the Holy Spirit.  And she got off the floor that night she was 100% healed by the power of God. I remember when she came home through the front door…

Sid:  Now you are fourteen at the time.

Matt:  I was fourteen years old, and I was twelve when she first got sick. Now I was fourteen, and she walked through the front door and I looked at her and I said, “Mom, what happened to you, who are you, you know you look like a totally different person.”  She did, she was not only healed on the inside but outside. She looked totally different, whatever oppression or sadness, or whatever it was that was on her with that sickness it was all gone, and she was smiling and she was laughing for the first time in two years.  And I remember it so deeply impacted me when she said to me, “Matt, tonight Jesus Christ came and healed me.”  And I remember the words she said, “Jesus is God and Jesus is the way to God and I’ve been looking for other ways to get to God and I found tonight that Jesus is the only way to get to God.”  And I remember that night suddenly as a fourteen year old kid having this conviction of sin in my heart, and I knew, I instantly knew no one else had to say anything to me, I knew that I had to have forgiveness of my sin.  And I remember asking Jesus into my life, repenting of my sin and then starting my relationship with God; in that week my whole family got saved. We learned that Jesus Christ was the only way and that He was also a miracle working God.

Sid:  Now when you looked at your mother, if she hadn’t said anything would you have really seen a difference?

Matt:  I instantly saw a difference before she said anything to me. As soon as she walked into that front door her whole countenance was completely transformed.  She was bright, she was smiling, she was laughing, and she had not done that in two years.  So yeah, visibly you could see that she was a totally different person.

Sid:   And your grandmother describes, and I guess your mother must have said, but your grandmother said that your mother literally when the power hit her what happened to her?

Matt:  She flew ten feet through the air (laughing).  She was airborne.

Sid:  Now do you think that there is a degree of exaggeration there?

Matt:  No there’s not, there’s not my mom actually it’s kind of funny, she got whiplash from the experience. She simply got knocked backwards so hard that she got whiplash, and she couldn’t move her neck.  And some people will say Holy Spirit’s a gentleman, he won’t hurt you.  But you know what’s funny, because the next day my mom is sitting in her room and you have to understand she doesn’t know the Bible yet, she has not read the Bible, all she know is that Jesus came and healed her.  So she was just talking to God and she said, “I don’t what you did to me, but I’m healed but you hurt my neck when I fell down on the floor.”  And instantly her neck was healed, and then the Lord healed the whiplash that she got.  But it was such a powerful force that she flew through the air and hit the floor.

Sid:  Now just out of curiosity with a back ground like that you obviously believe God heals, you have to believe that, but I understand when you first starting praying for people you didn’t have real good result.

Matt:  No, I remember as a teenager in church because it was right after that we joined a good Spirit filled church and started growing.  I remember you know God was just doing such a work in my, I walked right up to the front row.  Within you know, the first time in a Spirit filled church for me, it was all very new and very different so I stood on the back row.

Sid:  Was it scary when you saw people speaking in unknown tongues and raising their hands?

Matt:  It was different I had never seen anything like it so it was brand new for me.  Any type of an expressive worship, lifting hands, clapping, dancing, singing it was very very different so I was observing for the first month or two months or three months.  But I remember after the third month God really did something in my heart and I got so hungry for God that I walked from the back row all the way up to the front row by myself as a fourteen year old kid.  My parents, my brother at that point they still were lingering towards the back of the church room, but I remember you know I’m hungry for God I want this and I walked right up to the front and that’s where I stayed on the front row.  And then you know, I started growing in the church and started praying for people, I didn’t see much results you know, and it really, it frustrated me because I knew my Mom was healed and I knew that God had the power to heal people and that God was a powerful God.

Sid:    Well, you know most people are like you accept they maybe don’t know as much as what you knew from your mother’s experience, but most people they read the Bible, they read about healing, they pray for a few people, they have bad results. Then they say, “I guess I’m not supposed to.”

Matt:  Right and they get discouraged.

Sid:  Yeah.

Matt:  They just stop.  But I kind of had the opposite affect; what happened with me is that I think the Lord was putting inside of me such a supernatural hunger for Him that I ended up as a teenager really not going with the normal flow of what teenagers do. You know I found myself putting myself in my bedroom, shutting the door, playing worship music and for hours just spending time with God.

Sid:  Now, just out of curiosity did someone tell you to do this, or you were directed?

Matt:  You know Sid, no one told me to do, it was something that came from inside, it was totally the hand of God working on the inside of me.  There was no one saying, no one even teaching me, “You know Matt, you have to press into God if you are hungry for God you can have more.”  I was not hearing those kind of things. It was just something of a supernatural hunger in me that I could not ignore.  And it was this pulling force that said, “You’ve got to come and be with me.”  And so I remember you know just kind of following this dry from the inside and putting myself alone with God, playing the same worship music you know Sid but I heard singing in church you know.  I got worship tapes, back then it was Hosanna worship music, and I remember getting my Hosanna worship tapes, putting them in my bedroom and playing them and singing them.  And I remember when I was in church I would feel the presence of God and it was, it was wonderful to be in God’s presence. Then I’d go home and I’d be alone with God and it would be dry and it would be dead and I’m like, “God I don’t feel you, I want to feel you here like I do in church.”  So I got the worship music and I started playing the worship music and started just worshipping God, all by myself with no one around.  And I remember I did it every single day for four months straight and felt nothing.  Sang the songs, prayed the prayers, could feel nothing it was just, I was just doing it because I was hungry for God.  And then I remember the moment where it happened where I’m standing in my bedroom…

Sid:  I’ll tell you what hold that thought we’ll pick up here on tomorrow’s broadcast.

Sid:  My guest can’t help but be red hot for the Messiah, his name is Rob DeLuca. I have to tell you Rob that it provokes me to jealousy just seeing you on television, and being able to sit under that outpouring of God’s Spirit.  It’s got to be what a wonderful preparation. I’m reminded of the young man that had a visitation from God in which God showed your whole life to you.   I have to believe where you are right now was part of what God was showing you.

Rob:  Definitely, you know when I was a young man the Lord called me and He spoke to me and He said, that I would speak to the masses.  Matter of fact I’m sitting on the side of a lake one time and I saw the ripples of water you know shinning and glistening from the sun. The Lord said, “You see the ripples of water?”  And I said, “Yes Lord and they were endless and He said, “So you shall speak to my people.”  And we are seeing thousands upon thousands of people come out. I’ve had the privilege of being able to minister to some.  We’re also reaching over a hundred and thirty-eight million people via God TV and God is absolutely moving.  But you know out of all of you know the masses and the numbers, the thing that we’re loving the most is the presence of the Lord, the glory of God in the place and the hunger.  There are people all over the world that are so hungry for the presence of Jesus and that is causing God to show up in a mighty way like we have never ever seen before.

Sid:  What is God showing you about Israel and the Jewish people?

Rob:  Well, I had a prophetic word just about a week and a half ago, that I shared and the Lord showed me a vision and the vision went like this.  I saw the wind of God’s Spirit blowing through the cities and the towns and the villages of Israel.  And I saw leaves blowing and dust and I knew that it was the Holy Spirit, the wind of God blowing.  And the Holy Spirit said, “I am about to move mightily among the Jewish people, among the people of Israel.”  And then I saw a fire begin to burn over Jerusalem and also over Tel Aviv. The Holy Spirit spoke to me and He said, “A revival will to these two cities” and I saw arena’s filled with Jewish people worshipping Jesus Christ entering into His presence.  And the Lord showed me that there’s a great move of God that’s about to take place in Israel, and there is salvation that’s coming to Israel and there’s going to be great signs and wonders and miracles and healings that come to the Israeli people.

Sid:  Now I’m reminded of the scripture in Roman’s that says “Partial blindness has happened to Israel until the fullness of the gentiles comes in.”  It sounds to me like this is playing right into that scripture where spiritual scales are going to removed from the eyes of Jewish people.

Rob:  I really believe that we are in the season of end-time fulfillment, and when the Jewish people see the salvation of the Messiah and they start to receive Him, we know that the end is near. We know that there is something that’s taking place where prophecy is being fulfilled.  Or Romans 11 is being fulfilled in a way where God is about to bring forth a great salvation of His people.

Sid:  Well, again I’m reminded of 11 Paul says, “If it was a blessing the Jewish people rejected their Messiah,” and of course it was because Gentiles could be grafted in.  If it was a blessing for the Gentiles that Jewish people rejected their Messiah, how much greater blessing when they receive their Messiah, it will be life from the dead.  And life from the dead to me is resurrection power released of the full glory of God.

Rob:  I agree that there is going to be increase of God’s glory in the earth as His people, Israel, begin to accept Him and accept His Son.  I know that God is doing something in the earth with the Jewish people.  I heard within the prophetic word, a week and a half ago, “Son of Benjamin” and the Holy Spirit spoke to me and He said, “I’m raising up one that will be a leader over Israel and he will have a heart like David and he will be a defender of My people and He will be their deliverer and he will take out the Goliath that come against my people and once again I will bring salvation to Israel.”  And then the Holy Spirit spoke to me about a man named Benjamin Netanyahu that salvation is coming to his home and that God would use him also as a defender and as a protector of Israel.  So God is really stirring something up in Israel right now, and what’s going down in the Middle East and what’s taking place, God is on Israel’s side and He loves the Jewish people.

Sid:  Has God given you any insight how this great revival that’s about ready to hit Israel will affect the revival that’s being sprinkled on the whole world right now?

Rob:  Well, I really believe that when it does touch Israel, when this move of God lands and touches down in Israel that it’s going to cause something that hits the entire world.  We’re just seeing the ebb of it.  We’re starting to see fires break out in different parts of America and also in different countries in Scotland, Ireland, England, and Germany.  Revival fires are breaking out all over the world but, when it hits Israel I really believe that that’s going to be the igniting factor that causes this think to hit the entire world where the glory of God cover’s the whole earth.

Sid:  Now I know that prophets normally if they miss it they miss it on timing, but do you have any indication of the timing of this outpouring in Israel?

Rob:  I’m not sure and I’m not really one that gives dates or times, but I know that it’s soon just because of the acceleration that’s taking place concerning what God is wanting to do in the earth.  Everything is speeded up. It seems like 2008 there’s been an acceleration as never before in the world and out of nowhere there has been this great awakening in this last three months and it’s getting the world’s attention.

Sid:  Well, it’s obvious to me that there’s something coming on planet earth of let’s call it a great awakening, but it’s a genuine move of God’s Spirit.  But that also I see a lot of destruction in every arena of life and I think God going to make a distinction between those that are His and those that are of the world.  And I’m reminded of the scripture that the wealth of the wicked is stored up for the righteous.  How does that play in Rob?

Rob:  Well, I really believe that God wants to bless His people right now in the earth so that we can be a blessing.  I believe that God is raising up market place ministers, God is raising up financers that are going to be used to spread the gospel to all the nations.  But we cannot have in us anything that would say this is for me, this is all mine.  We do not want to lay up riches for ourselves on earth when there is something that’s eternal waiting for us in heaven.  So God wants to get finances into the hands of His people so that we can spread this good news all around the world.

Sid:  Well, I’m not sure why Rob, but just as you were saying that I literally the power of the Holy Spirit started causing me to shake.

Sid:  And do you know what my desire is?  It’s for myself, but it’s also for you I want to hear God’s voice so clear and I want to be obedient.  After all isn’t that the greatest purpose of life to fulfill your destiny, hear God’s voice and do what He wants you to do.  But so many people ponder, “Is it God or is it not.”  And I recently got a hold of book by Bruce Van Natta it’s called “Saved by Angels.” I mean it is the most amazing testimony but there is a supernatural quality that allows not just a super star because the only super star we have is Jesus, but allows everyone that has the Messiah in them to be able to hear God’s voice and to move in mighty exploits.  And there are ways that God is speaking to me and to you that many times we miss, but this book covers all the major ways and gives examples.  Now my guest Bruce Van Natta, I’m speaking to him at his home in Rudolph, Wisconsin.  Bruce on yesterday’s broadcast you talked about being sexually molested as a child. As a five year old Jesus wrapped you in His arms literally showered you with liquid love. Healed your little heart and gave you gifts of the Spirit, but then you didn’t tell anyone about this for twenty years, why?

Bruce:  Well, you know what it’s sad but we find even today it’s so easy to keep these things to ourselves and you know I keep thinking about this scripture Revelation 12:11 and it says, “They overcame him, the devil, by the blood of the Lamb and by the word of their testimony.”  And so that is just one verse that proves how powerful testimony is.  And when we keep it to ourselves we are actually robbing other people of the blessings that Lord wants to use us to foster in other people, and to use us just tools.  But I kept those things to myself for the most part, now some of these things I couldn’t keep like, right after I was hugged shortly after I had a vision a dream one night. It was walking hand and hand through heaven with Jesus.  And nobody had ever given me a description of the precious jewels and the street made of gold and all of that stuff. So I woke up in the morning and was exciting to tell my mom about this story and I told my mom.  Mom, mom listen to what I saw last night and I’m telling her I was walking hand and hand with Jesus and these beautiful stones, these layered stones were on the walls and the shinny ground, the shinny road and I was explaining to her.  Well my mom knew the definition of what somebody at some point she had read, or heard about it, you know what the description of heaven is going to be like. My mom got really scared and thought that maybe I was going to die and go to be with Jesus at that time. So I have to chuckle about that now, but my mom was a little worried at the time.  But these things started happening and we hear people being laid on of hands and after they’re laid on of hands then these manifestations of the Spirit, these gifts of the Spirit start popping up.  Well, when I prayed for Jesus to hug me you know that was a kind of a big time laying on of hands if you will and so these things started to happen and different things and that was dreams and visions was just one of them but.

Sid:  But Bruce, it took twenty years for you to share your testimony of what God did with you and you shared it to a woman that would become your wife.  What kind of impact did it have on her?

Bruce:  Well, when I shared the story it was out of reluctance. I was having this conversation with this girl that I was dating and she was asking me why did I believe so strongly about God. The real reason why I believe that there was a God was because of what happened when I was five.  But I had never told anyone and so at this time in my life I had to be honest and tell you I was not living by any means the Christians life and she called me on it.  And she said, “Well, you know you believe in God, but you’re doing this, you’re doing this you’re doing all these other things and I guess it doesn’t make sense to me.  And we’re having this conversation we’re going back and forth and she just kept coming back and saying, now take in mind that this conversation lasted about six hours and I mean it went on.  She wore me down and finally I didn’t want to tell, but finally I had, that was the main reason and I told her.  And I said, what had happened when I was five and how the Lord had hugged me and she began to cry. We prayed together and talked more and that was what the Lord used to actual bring her into a saving faith and realized that yeah there is a God that He is real.

Sid:  But I have to tell you when I found out what happened to you with that accident where the truck crashed on you you’re an auto mechanic, you were working on a truck. There is something about that, it changed your life, but does it change people’s lives the way I discern it does when they hear what happened to you?

Bruce:  Yeah, exactly even you know from doctors and nurses and the period of time that I was in the hospital over five different operations after the accident, yeah it does affect people.

Sid:  I’ll tell you how it affected me, it makes the invisible world so much more real. Did it have that affect on you?

Bruce:  Yes, it did, but because of being hugged when I was five and some of the things that had manifested in my life one of the things is, spiritual discernment and sometimes I can see into the spirit world a little bit.  And so it definitely has that affect on people.

Sid:  Give me one example, brief, of what happens when you see into the spirit world.

Bruce:  Alright a good example would be so now I’m in full time ministry and someone comes and they want to be prayed for. We start praying together and the Lord will sometimes show me or allow me to see in the spirit world and see a demonic presence hovering around that person, or kind of like sticking out of their head, or through their eyes or you can you know be a black shadow.

Sid:  And when you see this what do you do?

Bruce:  Well, what it does you know the Lord gives us these gifts you know it’s very…

Sid:  No, no what do you do when you see this?

Bruce:  I start praying.

Sid:  And can you see it actually leave?

Bruce:  Sure, yes, yeah I mean it’s clear that we’re given these gifts for the purpose…

Sid:  Okay, I don’t want to digress too much, but let’s go back you’re a automobile mechanic tell me what was going on when you had that horrific accident.

Bruce:  Actually I’m a heavy equipment mechanic on diesel on large things, large pieces of heavy equipment and trucks.  And so I was working on a Peterbilt logging truck, and I’d just finished up doing my portion of repairs, it was an engine filter head gasket. I was putting my tools away in the truck and guy that I was working with at this shop, I go around on sight, I go from place to place all over the state here I did.  And this particular shop that I was working in the man that I was working with was doing some other repairs on the vehicle of the truck. I finished my portion and he said, “You know he’s got this leak somewhere that he wanted me to just diagnosis, and he was going to fix the leak himself.  And so I ended up crawling underneath this Peterbilt truck and it fell on top of me.  And it was on a jack, he had jacked it up with a twenty ton bottle jack. It fell off the jack and the front axle came across my midsection and crushed me down because the right front wheel was off the truck and it has what the call low pro wheels on it, the front axle was pretty low anyway.  And so this 10, 11, 12,000 lbs comes down and crushes me like a blunt guillotine filled with cement. So it trapped me, and it’s kind of like you see in cartoons like Wyle Coyote, it just kind of trapped me in half where my body was roughly you know on one side probably an inch thick or less, and on the other side you know across my midsection maybe two inches thick.  It crushed all the way through top to bottom is where it went through and even you know cracked two vertebrae in my spine.  So it happened I stayed conscious long enough to see the first volunteer fire fighter show up who just happens to be in the area.

Sid:  Did you think that that was your moment that was your time to die?

Bruce:  Oh yeah, yeah I did, I did yeah.  In fact it happened, and all I could say was, God help me and that’s all could say, I said that twice, God help me.  Because I looked at myself and from my vantage point I thought I thought I was literally cut in half.  I thought I was from what I was looking at I thought I was in two pieces.

Sid:  I can’t think of much more awful circumstance to happen to anyone, I mean your guillotined in half you weren’t, but you were almost and that’s what you felt.

Bruce:  Yeah, well I’m laying there and they jacked the truck up, get it back up off of me.  And it took all the strength of the…big chrome of the front bumper, if you can picture a large semi, the large chrome front bumper was just behind my head. I was completely underneath the truck, and I reach my two hands back, I grabbed the bottom of that bumper, and I’m on a creeper, and I just pulled myself out because I want to get out from out of that truck really bad.  And they weren’t going to move me because they knew that I must have back injuries also so I just grabbed that front bumper and I pulled myself out to the point of my head was just sticking out from underneath of that front bumper of the truck. At that point is when I went unconscious, and that’s about the point that the doctor said I should have died.

Sid:  Well, you just have, I mean if nothing else you should bleed to death.

Bruce:  Exactly, we’d bleed to death internally because it didn’t…there was no external bleeding at all, it was all internal because the piece that crushed me was rounded and flat so it came down and just pinched me to an inch thick, just pinched me.  And so all the bleeding what it did was it severed by mesenteric artery that comes off of my heart towards the bottom.

Sid:  Now you’re saying that you were crushed to the point where your flesh was an inch thick, is that what you’re saying?

Bruce:  On the left hand side of my body was thinner than the right hand side, yes, yes.

Sid:  That is crushed!

Bruce:  That’s crushed, yes it is.  Like I said, it was all the way through the point that it broke my two vertebrae in my spine it cracked them you know and so you figure the thickness of your spine, that’s how thick I was in the center, that’s how thick I was in the center because it came all the way down to crack in my spine so.  Now in the center of my body on the left it was actually thinner than that, thinner than the thickness of my spine.

Sid:  Alright when you lost consciousness what is the next thought that you had?

Bruce:  Well the very next thing after I lose consciousness is a period of time lapsed and I’m not sure exactly how long but the next thing is I find myself up in the ceiling of this garage looking down and I can see myself, I can see my head sticking out from underneath this front bumper, my eyes were closed, my head was actually turned to the driver side.  The man that I was working with was on his knees above me running his fingers through my hair crying, I’ve known this man for a long time.

Sid:  You know I’ve been reading over the book of my guest that’s just literally right off the press, and it’s an unusual title called “Saved by Angels.” My guest’s name is Bruce Van Natta. I’m speaking to him at his home in Rudolph, Wisconsin just outside of Madison, and it’s an unusual title.  And I kind of questioned it when I saw the title, but as I read the book the effect that it had on me is that it made me sharper in hearing God’s voice; it made me take a little leap from where I was to understand the supernatural realm even better.  And I’m wondering Bruce, are you finding that others are having this effect when they read your book “Saved by Angels?”

Bruce:  Yes, that is exactly what we’re hearing, receiving emails, phone calls, have people stopping me hear locally in town. With tears in their eyes saying that you know that there’s things, questions that they had and about their faith they just never talked about or brought up.  And the Lord is just using this book as a tool to reach in their life and to show them that He wants a personal, intimate relationship specifically with them that touches every area of their life from waking to sleeping.

Sid:  Well, you know I’m thinking of the scripture Jesus said and it’s true, “My sheep hear my voice.”  And I have to tell you, when I read that I think in terms of being directed 24-7 with an audible voice from God.  And I don’t think I’m alone, and I thing that’s where I’ve been messed up for many years. I’m waiting for this spectacular, as a man that’s in heaven now used to say, “I’m waiting for the spectacular and missing the supernatural.”

Bruce:  Yeah, you know Jesus said, John 8:47 “He who belongs to God hears what God says.”  And like you said, you know a lot of times people are looking for the thunder bolts and the lightning and they’re looking for that supernatural stuff and so they miss out when God is whispering.  And we look at the scripture as a whole and we look back in the Old Testament and we see the prophet Elijah. You know the Lord didn’t speak to him in the wind, and He didn’t speak to him in the fire, and he didn’t speak to Him in the earthquake, He spoke to Him in that gentile whisper.  And that’s what we should be looking for then if you know if you ask somebody the question, “What is the general whisper sound like?”  Wouldn’t it be fair to say that that thought that pops into your mind that just comes into your mind, and that’s the typically I would say that the Holy Spirit speaks to us but we often times do miss it because we are looking for something spectacular.

Sid:  And that’s it, we can have a thought and we can dismiss it as our thought when it’s really God’s thought. Why should we dismiss it if we belong to God if Jesus is inside of us, the Holy Spirit of God is inside of us.  Like we had a going away party for one of our staff members last night and I had the thought because it was a surprise and she was coming in and I had the thought “Wouldn’t it be neat if everyone stands up because we had a lot of people there,” I don’t know thirty or forty people there, if everyone stands up and applauds when she comes in, it’ll be something she’ll never forget.  So I’m looking around for the woman that’s in charge of the function and I can’t find her and as I’m looking the woman says she stands up and say’s let’s everyone stand up when this person comes in and applaud.  And it’s like I don’t need to have that kind of conformation, but yet I guess my human side needs it but you know in light of reading your book and being more in tune to the voice of God as a result of the anointing on your book.  It was very exciting to me, it wasn’t someone being healed of cancer, but it was just as exciting because I heard God’s voice.

Bruce:  That’s right, that’s a validation, I love that when that happens too you know that you can be in a prayer meeting, or somewhere and you get that little thought, you know we can even say a voice whisper, whatever you feel comfort with.  And that comes across your mind and if you take the chance, if you put your pride aside and take the chance and say “You know what I think…”

Sid:    Is that what it is pride?

Bruce:  I think a lot of times it comes down to that because we don’t want to seem foolish, we don’t want to let’s say sound presumptuous, we don’t want to make a spectacle and so we especially don’t want to be wrong.  But when we put that stuff aside and just try an concentrate on the Lord and what He’s telling us, and something comes to your mind and you feel comfortable enough to say “You know I think the Lord might be saying this to me or just said this to me” it is such a great feeling when somebody else goes awe I just heard the same thing.  And then what’s really great is when it’s even an exact wording you know when it’s the same words just as your example from last night.

Sid:  Right, let me take you back this was a very dark period of your life and you were a child you were molested, abused, explain.

Bruce:  Yeah, well my parents both worked out of the house. My father was an over the road truck driver, my mom worked out of the house too and so there was a family that I often had to stay with and this family was a husband a wife with a son and a daughter.  And they molested their children and you know they would get drunk and perform sexual acts with each other and then the kids would get involved and it was just a really bad situation.  So at that time in my life I can only remember being to church one time ever, as a small child. It was a weekend at my Grandpa and Grandma were babysitting me and because they were babysitting me I went to church with them to some little tiny small country church out in the middle of nowhere. The man that weekend that was in charge of the Sunday school told the children of three of four of us that were there that about the story where Jesus is hugging little children and blessing children and the disciples get angry and try to chase the parents and children away.  And Jesus rebukes the disciples and say’s “No, let them come to me.”  And the Sunday school teacher said that the reason this was an important story was so that we understood that Jesus loved us and that He would answer our prayers.  And so fast forward five or six months I’m being molested over the period of roughly a year probably. Never told my parents what was going on.  When you look up molest in the dictionary it talks about stealing innocence. At five years old, and I’ve got four small children and they are a little bit older than that now, but at five years old you can confuse and manipulate a child and so that’s what had happened.  And so this stuff was going on, I was manipulated into not telling what was going on and finally some things happened that my parents realized you know something’s going on here.  She asked me, I told her, my dad as I said was an over the road truck driver. So he was going to come home on this weekend and so he came home and my mother was worried about telling my dad a little bit how he might accept it or take it because of some of the things that had happened.  And so as I’m listening to this conversation unfold out in the kitchen, I was in a bedroom that was just off of the kitchen/ The bedroom door went off of this kitchen and so I’m laying on top of the bed in the dark listening to my mother and father talk and it was getting later and they had actually been drinking and so the conversation kind of spun out of control. And like I said, my parents couldn’t understand why I hadn’t told sooner and why it didn’t come out sooner, and they’re worried about my future, worried about what I was going to turn into.

Sid:  And you’re hearing all of this this has to have a devastating effect on you.

Bruce:  Exactly, exactly and so as I was listening to it I kept feeling actually worse because I’m sure in defense of my parents I am sure they did not realize that I was listening to what was going on, but I was. I just kept feeling darker, and guilty and dirty, I just felt really dirty.  And so as I’m listening to this all happen this thought this little whisper comes into my head and at that time obviously I didn’t know it but now I can say clearly that it must have been the Holy Spirit.  And Jesus says in John that the Holy Spirit one of His jobs is to remind us of things, and so the Holy Spirit reminds me of this little thought just pops in my head and I remember what the Sunday school teacher said about Jesus loving little children and answering prayers.  And so as a five year old all I wanted was to be is comforted, and the best way that I could think of to be comforted. You know if you can remember being a child or if you can think of the way your children if a person is listening to this today has children, you know when one of your children fall down and hurt themselves you know what do they want or if they feel bad or they cry, what do they want?  They just want held and comforted and so that’s what I prayed for, I just prayed you know in my doubting Thomas personality that I have I just prayed, “Jesus if your real, if what that man says is real Jesus I want You to come and hug me right now, just hug me and hold me.”

Sid:  Bruce, when I’m listening to you I hear Grace Williams singing, “Never Let Go.”

Bruce:  And so the second those words left my mouth, and you know that dark room lite up, I mean instantaneously lite up and I felt arms wrapped around me tightly. Just holding me and comforting me.  It was incredible because it was a physical sensation, I mean I physically felt the arms wrapped around me, but yet it was also emotional, on the inside, I was held inside and out.  In fact I tried to describe it, but it’s so hard to describe to people, it’s like being dipped in liquid love because it covered me every inch of my body from head to toe and it was warm and it was glorious, it was just liquid love that would just dripped off of me.  And I just instantly could no longer hear the conversation of my parents, instant peace just peace you know I guess the best way to describe it. Instant peace and just the most powerful feeling of love that you can possibly imagine; and I feel asleep in Jesus arms just like that, I feel asleep.  And the next morning I woke up laying on top of my bed still dressed, just as I was the night before and I pondered okay, “What happened, I prayed that happened and even as a five year old it was completely obvious to me that a huge miracle had happened, I mean this was a miracle.”  I prayed God answered in a huge way and you know the sad thing is, the sad part about the story is that I never told one single person what happened for over twenty years, I kept that to myself for over twenty years. Never did I tell.

Sid:  We’re out of time but you received gifts of the Holy Spirit as a five year old.

Bruce:  Yes.

Sid:  That liquid love just descended on you.

Sid:  My guest Dr. Larry Bates I’ve had him on all this week, he’s a man that is knowledgeable of the economy, knowledgeable of politics, and knowledgeable of the Spirit of the Living God.  He is a publisher and editor of “Monetary and Economic Review”, former bank CEO, former member of the Tennessee House of Representatives where he chaired the powerful Committee on Banking and Commerce; he’s an internationally recognized speaker on political systems, the Federal Reserve and how they affect the economy and your assets.  Larry you were telling me before we went on the air that you were in a conference in Asia and something very unusual happened.

Larry:  Absolutely, Sid over ten years ago I spent 30 straight days doing economic briefings all over Asian’s seven countries in the wake of the Asian economic crisis.  Very similar to what we’re experiencing here except instead of being in Asia the crisis is centered here in the United States as far as our mortgage crisis, our real estate housing crisis etc.  But I was explaining, as I explain in this 3 DVD set we’re talking about here today, to a group in Hong Cong at the American club.  It was put on by the Full Gospel Businessman’s group and they had invited, it was the biggest collection of tycoons that I’ve ever seen in my life.  We had people like the chairman of Mercedes Benz of all of Asia.  We had Bill Clinton’s old buddies the Riatti’s – James Riatti, the Olimpo Group, we had the economic advisor to Tung Chee Hwa, the Governor of Hong Kong was there.  And when we got to question and answers I could tell that light bulbs were going on all over the room. Finally this one guy in his Chinese dialectical English he said, “How you know this, I now understand, how you know this, I want to know how you know this?”  I said, “Well let me be very clear, you know your current predicament in the economy has not caught God by surprise; He’s not having an anxiety attack over your predicament here in Asia, it didn’t catch Him by surprise; so if you want to understand as I have laid out to you today my source of wisdom and knowledge is from God, and the only way you can have the wisdom and knowledge from God is to have an intimate relationship with that.  And the only way you can have an intimate relationship with God is through His Son Jesus Christ.  They told me, I said “If you are interested see one of these men with the flower in their lapel and they told me five or six of those tycoons got saved that day.”  So you see when we present truth to a loss and dying world and when people are losing their assets I guarantee you one thing Sid you have their undivided attention.  And when you show them truth, John 8:32 is so clear, it says that yea shall know the truth and the truth will make you free.  It’s not the truth that makes us free it’s our knowledge of the truth that makes us free.  And this is what we have to do is be that Joseph generation that is helping people understand the times like the men of Issachar new and prepare for this greatest economic crisis that human history will ever see.

Sid:  Well, many prophets are saying there will be a great wealth transfer; it’s not a time to pull your hair out it’s a time to seek wisdom and to understand the economy and the political arena.  And in fact that’s why we’re making your three DVD’s available “Economical and Political Crisis” which actually will outline what has occurred to date and then the strategies for weathering any crisis while keeping your finances, political freedom intact.  Tell me about this wealth transfer, how can we be involved in it on the right side?

Larry:  Sure. I believe the scriptures when it says that the wealth of the wicked is going to be transferred to the righteous but I believe that God is going to allow the transfer to those who understand the system.  You know we wouldn’t give an expensive aircraft to fly to a 3 year old.  So likewise I don’t believe would put the burden of a lot of wealth upon someone who didn’t know how to handle it.  So this is why it is so important to get wisdom and understanding and understand how this system works.  You know the gospel is going to go forth and when the wealth of the wicked is transferred in the last days.  And I believe the wealth transfer system will be understanding the monetary system.  Because Ecclesiastes 10:19 says “Money answereth all things.”  A lot of people don’t know that’s in the scripture, money is the answer of everything.  Why do we get up and go to work in the morning?  Why do we save for retirement to have money, what is money?  Well, it is frozen or static labor, you know the old Hebrew view of wealth and labor was that you get paid so many shekels and you spend it for your current needs and what you do is you save it.  But Sid you know we can’t expect that our labor this week we get paid for we want to have the same purchasing power next week, next month, next year, 30 years from now.  But unfortunately because of the nature of our system we are losing the purchasing power and so this is why we need to know how to freeze our labor so that we have the same purchasing power 10, 15, 20 years from now.

Sid:  What about investments at this point right now?  Should people just have a completely liquid; should people put it in gold, and silver, what are you advising?

Larry:  First of all before I advise doing anything is understand the system, that’s the biggest thing you need to invest in is this 3 DVD set to get wisdom and understanding of how the system works.  Because action without information is what I call fanaticism, people take a fanatical approach based on what they hear on Wall Street, or what they hear on television or read in the newspapers.  But most of the people even writing the financial press doesn’t really understand how this whole system really works.  They just understand the Babylonian system because the mystery Babylon includes the financial aspect of it.  So first of all get understanding, but after you get that understanding start looking at your particular situation.  There’s not a cookie cutter formula, but in general we can say “Cash at the crash will be king.”  You want to have the cash in your money funds and cash in your CD’s but also your cash in your gold and silver coins.  Why gold and silver coins?  Because gold and silver is money, anything else is credit.  And you know we’re going to have a new currency, probably in North America, there has been a plan, it’s kind of been stymied for a while, but I believe out of the economic crisis you’ll have people brought to their knees and out of their distress they will cry out for some kind of government sponsored aid, and then in return for that aid you’re going to have to give up your political freedoms.  So quite frankly I don’t relish the thought of being in servitude to anybody so this is why, you know God wants us to be the head and not the tail.

Sid:  Now why do you say “There will be a new currency for North America?”

Larry:  Well, you look at history; let’s go to Brazil for an example.  You can look at the Carazo the Cardozo and now the Credo and now look at history around the world, the currencies and the more beautiful the currency is probably the less it’s worth.  You can use it to paper your bathroom or something like that.  So a lot of currencies…

Sid:  Now is that you’re spin that you believe that we are going to have a hyper hyper inflation in this country?  Where our dollars will be worth pennies?

Larry:  There’s no way around it Sid, because we’ll either have a collapse as we talked earlier in the week; we either going to have one or two things will happen.  We’ll have a default, collapse of the economy or we will have to print massive amounts of new money and create massive amounts of new credit just to keep the game going.  And every succeeding cycle when we get into this debt based economy, debt based monetary system every succeeding cycle you have a bigger bubble.  And when you have a bigger bubble it is less manageable, and quite frankly the Federal Reserve almost lost control of monetary policy in this particular cycle, there struggling, scrambling to get control at it again.  And this is why we saw the bail out of Fannie Mae and Freddy Mac to keep the entire U.S. and world economic system from collapsing.  Sid we have two years minimum, if we are fortunate, and five years maximum to get our house in order.  We better move fast.

Sid:  Alright what will be accomplished if someone watches your three DVD’s called Economic and Political Crisis?

Larry:  Well, one thing that you will see is you will see that there is a plan, there is a master plan and of course we have a war of world views.  The kingdom of Satan challenging the kingdom of God and this 3 DVD set with your question answer session outlines this war of war views in the areas of economic, politics, and religion that is cumulating in our present day crisis.  There is a plan; it’s a diabolic plan in order to enslave us because Satan is crafty.  You know the people that would even be putting this on us they are not our problem it’s the spirits that are controlling them are our problem.  And a lot of them are good people they just don’t understand what they are doing.  And the reason that a lot of people in the church have been in retreat is because they don’t understand the system, they don’t understand the battle, it’s kind of like the prodigal in the middle of Hosea 4:6 “My people are destroyed for they lack knowledge.”  And this is what we got to do is correct that so that God’s army and God’s people will come together and be that great occupying force in taking dominion like God told us to do.

Sid:  And I love this subtitle you have of the DVDs, “Strategies for weathering any crisis while keeping your finances and political freedoms intact.”  Do you believe if someone follows this and seeks God’s wisdom they will be the head as opposed to the tail?

Larry:  Absolutely, without a doubt because you know when we understand the system and understand who your enemy is.  See a lot of money is spent every year…

Sid:  My guest Marc Lawson is red hot for the Messiah. He’s Pastor of North Gate Church in Woodstock, Georgia.  And I’m interviewing him on his book the title is “It’s the End of the Church as We Know It.”  What do you mean by that Marc?

Marc:  Well, I had a series of visions they are all kind of progressive for different times of a fast forward to the church in 2000 this in the year 2000 on New Year’s Eve, then I had a fast forward seven years forward to 2007 New Years Eve, and New Year’s Eve 2012, and New Year’s Eve 2015.  Basically it was just a progression of watching how the Lord was going to demolish the way church had been operating.  It was like a landscape, a cityscape of a giant city and buildings were coming down and new things were being constructed and I asked the Lord what that meant and He said that it was, “It represented the disassembling of the church as we knew it to go from a pastor centric where a body of people go to watch one person do what he does and do his ministering while they simply spectate and don’t participate,” except in maybe a service where it grows to where the body does all the ministry, they do the healing and the equipping and they don’t do it in a service, they do it 24-7, seven days a week in Wal-Mart and in their job.  And then we realized that we can’t just let it accidently happen as people are on way to hear that were there we have to have strategic and intentional times so we set up, the changed our whole church schedule.  Our church schedule is Monday’s off, but we have Tuesday night, Wednesday night, Thursday night, Friday night are football games, Saturday we go down to a place called Jonesboro and preach in Tenements’, and neighborhood there.  And then Saturday night we’ll go to Wal-Mart and we’re there’s a youth gangs at a certain big Wal-Mart parking lot and there’s like 2 to 400 young people there for Saturday night.

Sid:  Now do you get about 5% of the church to participate this or do you get all church to participate?

Marc:  We talk, the way we started this a few years ago, we just took up, we said, “Let’s get a few to do it and see who wants to do it.”  And we learned instead of trying to pull everybody to the same place we worked with the people that were hungry, the people that were eager and early, the people that showed up early wanted to do it, they were eager and the people that were hungry for God jumped in on it.  And at first it was just my son, Ryan and a young man named David, and then we added a few then a grandma named Linda Ruby started going and then we’d have different people go.  We’d have a soccer mom come and a single lady with her two kids come.  And then the next thing you know everybody has been gone through the crucible of going to one of these outreaches, and some are still doing them strategically.  And they have one man named Nathan, I think twenty-eight, he’s got two house churches going in one neighborhood.  He went in and knocked on doors, went to a certain lady that had a miraculous remarkable healing got her saved and her whole family saved. Now they have house church’ there where they have fifteen, eighteen come every week.  And now that has grown to where he passed that off to the people that he went to at first and they got saved and got disciple.  And now there leading it and he went and one of the ladies that came to the house church said “Can we do this in my house too?”  So we’re doing it there as well, so there are just body people, these are normal people in the body everyday people.  But they’re taking church out of the church building, not that we needed church all the time, but it’s not we don’t meet it’s just that we take what God does here out on the streets, we take it to where we go.  And it’s taken about four years to change the whole culture to where everybody does outreaches, everybody can heal the sick, everybody can prophecy.  We have new people we had thirty-five new people come to a class and a luncheon the other day, they want to be members of the church.  So we do this maybe three or four times a year, and we take them and envision them and we can all do and we encourage all of them to go through this to go to some outreaches, learn how to do this.

Sid:  Now you have some unusual decor on the walls of your church building, what do you have mounted?

Marc:  Well, one of the laws we started a few years ago we had a meeting and we got a lady out of a wheel chair. When I say a meeting, I mean a church meeting.  We had a banquet for the poor there, every year we do these things called the Lord’s banquet around Christmas time and we have a bunch of people we’ve been preaching too all week into these meetings.  And one of these ladies had gotten out of a wheelchair.  So she let us keep the wheelchair, so that is on the wall and then we started to add to it.  We had a young lady at sixteen was with her dad and was at a conference and she was manning a booth, she and her sister and she was sixteen and her sister is fifteen and manning a booth.  A guy walks by them with a military man from Iraq, back from Iraq; he had crutches.  She and her sister prayed for this man in the lobby of a hotel of a business conference.  He was just walking through there, she got him healed, prayed for him twice.  The pain left and he gave her the crutches and he walked away, so that was one of our first crutches.  So we have crutches, we have wheelchairs, we have neck braces, arm braces, there are things that you wrap around your leg.  So the building is covered one whole wall is covered with trophies of these miracles.

Sid:  Now, you have some interesting terminology in your book, you talk about the welfare system of Christianity, what do you mean?

Marc:  Well, we created a welfare state and we knew, we found out in the 90’s when the Federal Government abolished welfare and realized that you got to get people a job, they have to work.  You have to have full employment, Matthew 20 talks about this, how they went out to get some people to work in his father’s vineyard, the man went out to get the people to work in his vineyard.  He went out that morning, hired some people, he went out a few hours later, hired some more.  But nobody was hiring anybody, and I think that’s kind of where we’re at in our nation today in the church.  The church is a system where a few do all the heavy lifting, and the body does no work, they watch.  And we have told people that they’re too sinful to be operating in this, they are not holy enough or they are not qualified enough or their not righteous enough, and the Bible’s real clear that’s not true at all.  Jesus said, in John 14 “Greater things that these you can do.”  So we preach our people that the minute that you’re born again, and the minute you have an encounter with the Holy Spirit like I did when I got born again, when Jesus is in you, Christ is in you the hope of Glory is in you you can raise the dead, heal the sick, everything Christ did you can do; He said that.  And He said He wants us to do that and we’re responsible to go to the highways and the byways, and compel them to bring them into the Kingdom so it’s not…

Sid:  But if someone can do what you’re just described they’ll get their own television show, that’s not normal, that superstar.

Marc:  Well, I think that God wants to demolish the superstar thing when you have everybody in your church healing the sick like televangelist do now, and you have people that regularly, when you have everybody is operating in the gifts, what happens is the water level, the supernatural, the glory level in your church goes up markedly.  Or you might have a few gifted people leading everything and doing all the ministry you might have a great anointing in that church but when everybody starts doing it everybody’s water level goes up; everybody gets saturated; everybody gets blessed.  And I think that’s what Ezekiel 37 talked about Sid.  It said, “What do you see?”  And I think that what they say to the church now, it’s like a welfare project where nobody does any work everybody is unemployed; nobody is doing anything and that doesn’t work.  You have to get people employed in their ministry so we try to find out through prophetic ministry what everybody’s ministry are, and we try to train everybody.  Andy believer can preach whatever your gift mix is, your apostolic, your prophetic, you’re a teacher, you’re evangelistic or you’re prophetic; you can preach and bring the kingdom to them through your gifting and so we release them and give them opportunity.  We changed our schedule we don’t have programs in our church, our programs are the whole body is getting trained all the time. So that’s our program, equipping the saints.

Sid:  Do you find more miracles take place outside of the church than inside of the church and why?

Marc:  Yes we do Sid and the reason for that and we do have miracles and we do have testimonies; most of miracles in Sunday gatherings and our body gatherings, or Wednesday gatherings of the body are testimonies of what the Body has done during the week; the other hundred and sixty-six hours.  I wrote the book, “The End of Church as We Know it” the one-sixty-six factor that the one hundred sixty-six hours, the one sixty-six factors are the hours that we’re not in the church building for those two hours a week and doing it.

Sid:  Well, why are there more miracles outside of the church then in the church?

Marc:  Because Jesus told us to go to the needy, He didn’t tell us to go the, didn’t say find the found, He didn’t say, preach to the preached you know.  Most of the church the system, the church system is the problem.  It’s not the people don’t want to do it, or that the leader don’t want to do it; it’s just the wheel operating with the system that’s broken that has to be fixed; we have to change it.  We have to… this is as great a reformation to get the body to start doing the ministry.  As the first reformation where we got the word of God into the hands of the people, now God wants to bring another reformation to bring the ministry into the hands of the people.  And the leaders, the apostalolic leaders that released people to go and do this, you will see great works out there because the body is suppose to do the works out in the highways and byways.  Our ministry, the field is the world; the field isn’t in a church building or a two hour church service.  And so most of who we’re called to minister to we haven’t met yet and so we have to send our people into Woodstock into our local community.

Sid:  Do you know what the problem is and you said this on the tape that we’re offering, we’ve got too many doctors, too much alternative health, too many vitamins, we don’t have to rely on God.

Marc:  And so we go to people that don’t have health plans; they don’t we go to the poor, we go to the needy, we knock on their door.

Sid:  Oops our time is slipping away.

SID: Hello. Sid Roth here with Dr. Maldonado. And you know people that are addicted to pornography. What happens if someone that is addicted to pornography for 20 years? And you know what concerns me? That concerns me. But even worse this leads to other things. Tell me about someone that was addicted to pornography and what happened to them.

GUILLERMO: That’s exactly what happened, Sid, what I was telling you. Before I entered, had the revelation of the ministry of deliverance, I had graduated. I have a doctorate in one of the universities, Vision University, and they told me about many things about counseling and things. The thing is when I have this person in front of me crying out and saying, “Pastor, will you pray for me.” They said, “I speak in tongues. I’m bound to Jesus, but I love pornography. Can you help me?” And I’ll try to analyze things and suddenly they start manifesting in front of me. So in that particular moment the Holy Spirit came up on me. We lift the spirit of pornography, remember what Jesus said about the woman with the back condition? Jesus didn’t call it like today, call it like it is.

SID: Yeah. He said, “bound by Satan 18 years.”

GUILLERMO: The spirit of sickness. He called it like it is. Like we call sin issues. No, we have to call it like it is. So I said, “The spirit of pornography come out.” In that particular moment, 20 years of pornography, bound in pornography, he was completely set free in one second with the power of the Holy Spirit and the power of the Word.

SID: There seems to be an increase in schizophrenia. Are you seeing this among the people you know?

GUILLERMO: I have seen hundreds of people being delivered. I’ll give you a case.

SID: A schizophrenia person being delivered?

GUILLERMO: Schizophrenia, yes. Schizophrenia is a demon. Now. If you go from the psychiatrist’s point of view they will tell you it’s an unbalance in the brain.

SID: You need chemicals.

GUILLERMO: Right. So you need chemicals to balance, whatever. So in my case, when I’ve dealt with that as a spiritual, you cannot deal with spiritual things with emotional mental things. You have to work with the right medicine. So this girl, 14 years old, came into the church, they disabilitied her because somehow they said, you’re crazy. You’re never going to drive. You’re not going to school and you’re going to be admitted to a hospital. She came, she was set free, she went back to college, normal, drive. Everything was free in the moment.

SID: Tell me about the Cuban witch.

GUILLERMO: The Cuban witch got one of my teachings got into his hands, and somehow he started reading, hearing the teaching. And the moment he’s hearing the teaching something happened to him. He started being delivered. And after being delivered of witchcraft and Santeria and witchcraft, and all that, he was set free. He called all the witches, 50 witches and prayed for them, and they were free.

SID: Dr. Maldonado, you teach on breaking curses and the most wonderful things happen to people. Would you teach our people right now. I want you to mentor them so that they can be free like the people in your congregation.

GUILLERMO: First of all, they need to understand what is a curse. A curse is like a shadow, like something that you are ready to do something, but there’s like an invisible hand that removed the blessing that God asked for you. So it’s transferable from one generation to another generation.

SID: Give me some examples of curses.

GUILLERMO: For example, it can be someone that if I got cases in our church where all the women in the family became single women. For somehow they got divorced and the mother, and the grandmother. I have seen, for example, men that three generations of alcoholism, examples like that. How do you break it? First of all, you need to understand this is the basic theology, the doctrine, the knowledge behind it is that Jesus Christ took our curses for us to receive his blessings, Galatians 3:13. In other words, we need to have a foundation. There is a scripture where Jesus said he took the curse for you to receive the blessing. So second, you need to renounce it. I want to teach you how to do it, verbally, you got to renounce specifically about that curse. And number three, you cast it out. You command the spirit behind the curse to come out from you, and you will see that taking place. If you do it with faith, I have seen hundreds of people doing it and being free.

SID: Why is it then when people go to other countries that speak and proclaim the Gospel, hundreds of manifestations occur of people that have demons inside of them. But in the United States there’s not a discussion. You don’t see demons being cast out. You don’t even see manifest in most congregations. Why is that?

GUILLERMO: There are so many reasons, Sid. And one of the reasons is that we as Americans, we have so many options. God is the third or fourth place. In other words, I have the doctor and I have the hospitals.

SID: The psychologists, drugs.

GUILLERMO: Psychologists. We have so many options. Whenever you have only one option, death or life, you’re going to believe God. And I think this is the moment that many people that are watching now, that they don’t have many options. There’s only God or they die. I have seen people. And number two, I believe is the kind of preaching that we’re preaching. Because with the preaching of the Gospel of the Kingdom there has come healing, there has to come deliverance, there has to come deliverance from generations of curses. But we’ve been preaching something else. We’ve been preaching another kind of gospel that doesn’t bring that manifestation.

SID: I pray that you would become normal, normal as defined by the Bible. I’m going to have Pastor Maldonado break curses over your life and pray by the spirit over you, and I promise you many of you that are bound to addictions, bound to pornography, bound to alcohol, bound to drugs, bound to sex outside of marriage, bound to deviant lifestyles, you’re going to be free. You know why? You’ve just heard the truth and the truth will set you free. Don’t go away. We’re going to be right back.

SID: Hello. Sid Roth here with Dr. Maldonado. Any many of you have had curses on your life. Some of you don’t even know where it came from. It could have come from four generations back. I mean, there are people that every time it looks like you’re going to get ahead, the car breaks down, bills pile up. There are people that are depressed all the time. There are so many types of curses. I mean, it doesn’t have to just be alcoholism or drugs, or pornography. There are many areas in the health area, in the marriage. It seems people, they get divorced and they get married, and then they get divorced again. This is not the way God created it. It’s not the way it’s supposed to be.

GUILLERMO: Yeah. I believe also rejection. There are so many people trying to, rejection is the deepest wound, emotional wound in people. And I have seen people always like someone looking from outside, but not belonging, feeling that they don’t belong.

SID: You know, some people, because they didn’t want a pregnancy, even in the womb, that spirit of rejection.

GUILLERMO: Yes. So I believe there is a moment that Jesus Christ, the solution, Jesus Christ, it doesn’t matter, like Sid, you were saying about many people thinking, well I have to, they’re accustomed to it. They conform to it.

SID: It’s become their friend.

GUILLERMO: Yeah. And I tell you now, Jesus Christ set you free. He took your curses, your sickness, your rejection. He was rejected for you to be accepted in the beloved. And right now I’m going to pray for you, if you’re watching me, that you can receive that deliverance. It doesn’t matter what you’re going through. It doesn’t matter how oppressed on your mind, if you’re depressed, if you’re full of fear, some people are trying to go ahead and they’re afraid. They’re afraid to failure. They’re afraid to many things.

SID: You dealt with rejection yourself.

GUILLERMO: I did. And I dealt with the fear. I was the most fearful person in the world, Sid. And the Lord set me free. I was afraid of my own shadow. And now when the Lord set me free, Sid, I can tell you now I am the boldest person in the world. When the Holy Spirit comes upon me, I’ve gone into funeral homes and prayed for a dead person.

SID: Did you ever think that you would be able to speak in front of large groups?

GUILLERMO: Never. I was so timid. I was so afraid. Timid is one of the ways of fear. And I was so afraid, but the Lord set me free. I can speak to you with authority, not only just the theology behind it. But a spirit is being free of rejection and free of fear. So the same thing that happened to me, I can pray that happened to me.

SID: Would you do that?

GUILLERMO: Yes. I want you to stretch your hands wherever you are now. It doesn’t matter what you’re going through. It doesn’t matter if it’s in your mind. Jesus Christ came and he forgave you for you to receive his forgiveness. Father, in the name of Jesus, I give you praise and I give you honor. Thank you for those people that are watching. I want you to stretch your faith. It doesn’t matter what you’re going through. Maybe it’s just a poverty thing. It may be just a marriage, broken marriage is in your family. It doesn’t matter what it is. Right now, Lord Jesus, I break every curse. And right now, every curse and the emotional, and the rejection, sickness, diseases, poverty, right now, sin, I command every sickness and disease, I command every curse go in Jesus’ name. If you’re watching me now and if you’re confronting things like pornography, if you’re saying, Pastor, I feel like something has happened to me, I’m bound, Father, in Jesus’ name I command every spirit of pornography come out, come out, come out of those people. Come out of their mind. Come out now! Any bondages be free in Jesus’ name. Amen. Depression, people with depression, right now, the Lord is something lifted from you. Depression, go in Jesus’ name. Rejection, go in Jesus’ name. Any curse, I break it and I release the blessing of God in Jesus’ name. Amen and amen.

SID: What are some of the open doors to the demonic?

GUILLERMO: When people practice the occult, any kind of occult to, I would say, continue sin, you know when you sin one time and you repent, that demon will not come and attack you. But if you continue to practice the sin it will open the door for that. And number three, I would say unforgiveness. When you have unforgiveness in your heart you’re giving the devil a legal right to attack your body or your spirit.

SID: How dangerous is it watching X-rated things on television or in the movies?

GUILLERMO: Again, it is an open door. There are so many open doors that we can talk about, and that is one of them, is X-rated movies. I have seen, for example, a girl was watching X-rated movies, and suddenly she was oppressed by a demon and we have to deliver her, because she opened the door willingly into that thing, and that is very dangerous.

SID: There are so many movies of witchcraft and magic, and voodoo. All of these things are treated as normal today. Is that dangerous?

GUILLERMO: Yes. It’s very dangerous. And Sid, the thing is people are looking for an experience with the supernatural. Unfortunately, they can’t find it in churches.

SID: Why is it that most churches in America or in the world, for that matter, don’t even talk about this subject? Why?

GUILLERMO: I can tell you many reasons also. But I think one of them is the kind of preaching that we are preaching. The Bible talks very clearly about the Gospel of the Kingdom. And this is what happened, Sid. Every time you saw Jesus preaching the Gospel of the Kingdom, you saw four things that could not stand in the presence of the Kingdom. Number one, sin, number two, sickness, number three, demons, and number four, death. Those four things could not stand when Jesus preached on the Kingdom. Matthew 4:23, he preached the Gospel of the Kingdom and then he cast out demons, and then he healed the sick. And then we’re not preaching the Gospel of the Kingdom, because everywhere I’ve been, I’ve been in 50 countries of the world, and every place I’ve been even in the States, I’ve seen tremendous deliverance in the States. One of the reason our church has grown so fast is because the ministry of deliverance. People come and have deliverance. People are trying many things, many cures, but their dealing with the branches. If I tell you I’m of presence of mind, I want to commit suicide, I got schizophrenia, they will give you a bunch of pills. You become addicted, but you’re dealing with the root. The root is the blood, the root is the power, the root is the anointing of the Holy Ghost.

SID: And you know the most wonderful thing is when people finally get free in these areas. Sickness can’t even come near them. They get set free of sick they’ve been dealing with their whole life when these curses are broken, when these open doors are closed. What are you seeing in your church? Are you seeing many people are healed when they get set free?

GUILLERMO: Yes because, like when we started from the beginning. Eighty percent of the sickness in people is caused directly or indirectly by a demon. And when we remove the root of the problem you will see people come free. And there’s something happens, Sid, I have seen even my own leadership in the beginning, I saw that something happen to my leadership when I delivered them became so alive in God, because demons will oppress your mind, will bring fears. It won’t let you go ahead in life.

SID: Well it’s time for you to go ahead in life. This is your moment. Some of you say, I’m born again, but this is what the Bible says. This is eternal life that you might know him. Now you have to come to know him. You know him by repenting of your sins. Grace without repentance isn’t even grace. But grace with repentance, belief that Jesus died for your sins and belief that he is the Lord of your life and lives inside of you, that is coming to know Jesus.

Sid:  I am so excited about this brand new book by Steven Brooks.  The title is “Standing on the Shoulders of Giants, the Release of Mantles to the End-Time Generation.”   And this is, in fact you say this Steven, you say “This is going to be greatest time of release of mantles in history.”  What makes you say that?

Steven:  Well, I believe that Sid because it’s interesting when we see the great miracles that happened in the early church, when a person reads through Acts chapter 4, Acts chapter 5 and through on the books of Acts we see wonderful miracles.  But I believe that Jesus has saved the best wine for last and just like he did at his first miracle which at the wedding of Canaan that was a sign that He had saved that best wine for last.  And I believe that the greatest anointing is going to come upon the end-time church because Sid we’re the ones responsible.  And those that are listening to us today we are the ones responsible for taking the gospel to the entire world, that’s a tremendous job.  There’s almost 7 billion people now, there has to be an increase in the anointing, and mantles released to accomplish this monumental task.

Sid:  Now I would think that most of this would be sovereign it would just happen, but you indicate there’s something we can do about it.

Steven:  That is true Sid, we can position ourselves to receive from the Lord and to be opened to an increase in the anointing upon our lives.  And it’s not just for ministers, but it’s for those that are called.  You know when we talked on the program yesterday about all those pieces of clothing and I saw in that stack of clothing the Lord told me that those were mantles that …

Sid:  For those that weren’t listening yesterday Steven was caught up into the second heaven, and saw a bunch of clothing that was being guarded by demons. The Lord sent a couple of angels that were like decoys and run, flew right by them and all the angels, the demons ran after them.  And this must have been quite a sight to behold Steven.

Steven:  It was remarkable sight and an experience that even though this was years back it seems to me like it just happened yesterday because it was such a clear visionary experience.  But Sid all those different pieces of clothing represent different occupations that people have in life.  In other words for the end-time church there’s mantles and increased anointing for ministers.  There is mantles increased anointing for business men and business woman; for school teachers, for doctors.  There is an anointing you know you think back in the Old Testament about Bezalel that anointed man that made all the carvings and things for the Tabernacle of Moses.  The Bible talks about how that man was greatly skilled with wisdom and knowledge and understanding of all types of craftsmanship and he worked it with jewelry and with gold and with silver.  So there’s an anointing for those types of areas; I believe the Lord is anointing people today to create art work, to create jewelry to create music that comes from the heavenly realm that cannot be pulled out of the earth realm that will be coming down from heaven.

Sid:  And you know Steven I believe and most of us are aware of the economic problems in the world really going on right now, and people are fearful etcetera.  But I believe with one of these mantles someone could do anything, anything they wanted they could make billions of dollars.

Steven:  Absolutely Sid, and I believe that end-time kingdom financiers are being raised up by the Spirit of God, and that anointing of Joseph will be resting upon the end-time church.  You know Sid, we see in Acts chapter 5 how the early church there was no lack amongst them.  Now today in the church there is such lack and people have such problems with credit debt and other types of debt and other types of debt or just insufficiency.  But the Spirit of God is going to move sovereignly, instantly in such ways that the anointing’s coming upon those who are qualified to walk in Joseph anointing.  That the debt and the lack is going to be eliminated from the church.

Sid:  Now tell me a little bit more about the mantel. You just pulled some blue clothing out, and this was on a minister from how many years back?

Steven: Fourteen hundred years ago.

Sid: You actually got a book about him and what did you find out about his life?

Steven:  This was a book that was recorded in the Old Catholic writings of the Old Catholic Church. This man lived in the area of Scotland, and he was contemporary with St. Patrick. Right along that same time frame there were a lot of the early, what we would call Celtic Saints, and the Lord told me who that individual was, and said “he was one of My trusted prophets.”  Certainly there were many during that time frame, but it’s interesting that I was able to find teachings about his life. Actually a whole book was written on his life and preserved for all of those years.

Sid:  And just out of curiosity are there some things that he moved in the Spirit that you’re not moving in that you read about and that you’re looking forward to that?

Steven:  Well, one of the things that this gentleman had was an anointing for raising the dead. I know that the Lord has an apostolic grace upon my life, but I have not yet had an opportunity to pray for somebody who is dead and see the Lord do a miracle. I believe the Lord is going to open those doors are the right time and I’ll see those things take place.  So there’s a prophetic anointing, but there is also the apostolic which is a different type of flow.  And I’m looking forward to seeing dead raised up in our meetings; we’re seeing all types of healing miracles take place, tremendous miracles actually.  But nobody’s brought in dead people in yet or nobody died in the meeting.  But I know in the Lord’s way we’ll see those things happen also.

Sid:  We were talking about end-time financiers of the Kingdom of God that God’s going to be raising up.  You had a pretty interesting experience with six angels, six golden angels in Israel.

Steven:  That is true I was ministering in a conference Sid earlier this year, just a few months back in the summer.  And the conference was held right on the top of the Mt. of Olives and it was a packed out meeting, but one night when I was ministering I was the speaker that night. After I had finished preaching I knew that angels of financial breakthrough, angels of prosperity had come into the meeting and they went and stood right behind me.  Now I didn’t tell the people that financial angels are here, sometimes I don’t always talk I always try to give the glory to the Lord.  But I said, “The Lord’s here to help you with your finances.”

Sid:  But I don’t know I think I have to argue with you on that one because when people know that there are golden angels their faith is going to accelerate.

Steven:  That is true Sid and many times I know when the healing angels come into the meeting and I’ll acknowledge that and sometimes it depends on where I’m at and sometimes.  It also depends on how the Spirit is moving if I choose to call that out, you’re right it’s a give and take because you have to be led of the Spirit when to do that to keep that flow going.  That’s the thing that you want to keep that anointing going.  Those angels came in and I said, “The Lord’s here to help you with your fiancés, the Lord’s going to do miracles for people.”

Sid:  And what did you see going on in the Spirit after you said that?

Steven:  I saw the angels stand behind me and I called some of the people just to come stand up on the platform behind me.  And one person who did told me the next morning that this individual received a tremendous financial miracle that happened over night after that meeting ended.  And the angels had gone to work; the very next morning he had received a call from his wife and told me about a tremendous financial miracle that the Lord had done.

Sid:  Tell me how tremendous it was.

Steven:  It was six figure, six figure blessing I’ll say it like that, which is pretty good.

Sid:  Were there any others that you heard reports on?

Steven:  There was another lady that was in the meeting that she wanted to come to this meeting so strongly that she said, “I’ve got to be at this conference, I’ve got to be at this meeting.”  And she told her work I need to go to Israel to this meeting.  They said, “Well, if you go you won’t have your job when you get back because we need you here and we can’t give you the time off now.”  And she said, “I’m sorry I’ve got to go to the meeting.”  And Sid she cleaned out her desk before she left, she gave up her job, a good job to leave and go to this conference to attend these meetings to get in on that anointing.

Sid:  She must have had her faith level at all time high to take a stance like that.

Steven:  That is true Sid and she really heard from the Spirit of the Lord to step out and to do that which is all so very critical; but while she was there my wife and I prayed for her.  I prayed for her because I knew the angels were there and I said, “Lord, when you go back I pray that you bless her with a tremendous job.”  Sid when she got back she received a phone call from the Vice President of one of the largest banks here in America, actually it was Bank of America.  And was told I got your resume here, here at my desk and she never even turned in a resume there, she never even turned in an application there.  And he said, “I’d like to offer you a phone interview for a job over the phone.”  And there was no going down to fill out an application, nothing like that, they did a short phone interview over the phone and he said, “Great, when can you start?”  And got a tremendous executive job that paid better than the job she had before.

Sid:  Now just out of curiosity did anyone else see these six golden angels beside you?

Steven:  Well, that conference was being broadcast to a potential viewing audience of 2 billion people. There was a conference host who actually read a testimony from an email sent in from a lady from China.  Sometimes people risk their lives to shoot off these emails from some of these areas where the gospel is not allowed and this lady had sent an email in that said, “When Steven Brooks started ministering last night, as he was ministering I saw six golden angels come in and stand behind him on the platform as he was speaking.”  So she actually saw the angels and other people did too, other emails came in of people who saw the angels.

Sid:  You know I think that’s so amazing that you shared with us that once you got this particular mantle, what was this mystics name?

Steven:  Well he was one of the early Celtic saints and his name was Columba.

Sid:  Actually Kathy Walters wrote a book on these saints and I think she spoke about him.

Steven:  He was known as one of the true prophets that walked those Islands, lived on the small Island of Iona.

Sid:  Well, my goodness I might get you towards the end of the week to push your gift of prophecy, but time is slipping away and these mantles are waiting for you.